When Muslims criticize India and Hinduism

[hollisterdesi]

Are they aware of the fact that their families were previously Muslim, and that its an 80% chance that they were converted due to economic pressure (jizya, or giving a poor man money in exchange for conversion), life threats (during times such as the Ghazni invasions, "convert or die"), or for status (converts were promoted to higher Mughal courts)? Jw, cuz many seem oblivious to it.

[indianchick87]

HEY its the white boy! ;) :joy:

[dEsI_sHeR86]

you mean previously Hindu*, before 600 AD noone was Muslim, lol

[typeOnegative]

Maybe they do, maybe they don't. Whats the big deal?

[hollisterdesi]

Maybe they do, maybe they don't. Whats the big deal?


B/c they're ignorant if they are oblivious to it. Knowing that you live a lie, and that you are how u are today as a result of a barbarian's sex appetite or a corrupted ruler's desire to forcefully make pppl adhere to his religion.

[typeOnegative]

B/c they're ignorant if they are oblivious to it. Knowing that you live a lie, and that you are how u are today as a result of a barbarian's sex appetite or a corrupted ruler's desire to forcefully make pppl adhere to his religion.Agreed. But hey, shit happens. :) They are Muslims now and if they want to rant and rave as Muslims instead of ranting and raving as Hindus then so be it dude. Why do you care?

[dEsI_sHeR86]

B/c they're ignorant if they are oblivious to it. Knowing that you live a lie, and that you are how u are today as a result of a barbarian's sex appetite or a corrupted ruler's desire to forcefully make pppl adhere to his religion.

The thing is they don't believe it because what their paki history and mullahs say and believe themself, the bottom line of the Quran is any religion that isn't Islam is haram. Islam is strongly against everything Hinduism stands for like spirituality and wisdom, if they was to observe reality and read undistorted factual history they'd learn the truth and chup.

[monit88]

i so love these threads when hollisterdesi and sher burn the muslim ppl in Rd. heck i am hindu i should be with for you guyies, well i am 100% just dont rlly know but i love these threads. man they will never get the point

[hollisterdesi]

They can be w/e they want now. Im jus sayin y they ignoring their past?

[gabroo_shakeen]

Are they aware of the fact that their families were previously Muslim, and that its an 80% chance that they were converted due to economic pressure (jizya, or giving a poor man money in exchange for conversion), life threats (during times such as the Ghazni invasions, "convert or die"), or for status (converts were promoted to higher Mughal courts)? Jw, cuz many seem oblivious to it.

When muslim ppl diss India (esp pakistanis) its so retarded. Like why exactly do u hate the country? Like there are more Muslim ppl in India than Pakistan n they don't go around hatin pakistan (although i've seen a few that do). N muslim ppl are doin so well in India, they got good jobs n they live a way higher quality of life in India.

Yes forced conversions are so stupid. What gives ppl the ryte do force ppl to do somethin they don't wanna?

[typeOnegative]

When muslim ppl diss India (esp pakistanis) its so retarded. Like why exactly do u hate the country? Like there are more Muslim ppl in India than Pakistan n they don't go around hatin pakistan (although i've seen a few that do). N muslim ppl are doin so well in India, they got good jobs n they live a way higher quality of life in India.

Yes forced conversions are so stupid. What gives ppl the ryte do force ppl to do somethin they don't wanna?
Point. But the same goes the other way too.

[typeOnegative]

They can be w/e they want now. Im jus sayin y they ignoring their past?I dont think they do. They think that the change has been for the better. Which is debatable maybe. But then that is life. :)

[dEsI_sHeR86]

not even Islamic countries pay for Eid pilgrimage and job reservations just for being Muslim, but hey one day the shit will hit the fan and truth will be exposed, i believe in karma and i feel it, ill be ready too

[typeOnegative]

The High birth rates of Muslim women.
Hey, good for infant girls born Muslim.

[typeOnegative]

not even Islamic countries pay for Eid pilgrimage and job reservations just for being MuslimI think that paying for the 'Haj' (not Eid pilgrimage) is wrong and a secular country (at least in theory) should not do that. But you are wrong on the job reservation part. India does not reserve jobs for Muslims. And countries in the Gulf are reserving jobs for their natives - who happen to be Muslims ....

[no_coast_desi]

Pratik, even though u r very friendly, ur a complete idiot. Islam derived from not wanting to worship statutes and idols u fool. Many people questioned before 600 AD whether or not they want to worship rocks or manmade creatures. Thus, Islam was revealed back then. Also, Hinduism is a polythestic religion, they believe in more than 1 god. With Ganesh, Shiva, Vishnu, Rama, Brahma, and the other Gods you guys worship. Many Muslims didnt believe in that concept. And now u tell me that they were forced to convert in that era, no they werent forced to convert back then. The Quran was revealed back then and it started to grow rapidly. Also, I dont know anything about economic pressure that took place between India and Pakistan, therefore its not my place to comment. But I can say, to embrace a religion has to come from the heart. They can easily say we're one religion, but truly in their hearts only God knows their intentions. Do you know whatI mean? If people were forced to convert back then, accepting a religion comes from the heart man. Also, You think you know everything, but essentially you dont. Islam does not consider *haram* if other people dont accept Islam as the only religion or whatever BS logic u just gave. I advise U to pick up the Quran and read instead of posting a forum in which u have no knowledge to speak or even comment about. Islam is unity, peace, and harmony man. They are very understanding of other religions, but yes, when living in an oppressed society where U cant practice your religious beliefs, then yes it does say in the Quran to take action towards it, which isnt wrong. So dont say Islam considers it haram, b/c it doesnt. I doubt u have even picked up the Quran and even read a couple of verses. Also, I will admit my ancestry is from India. No Doubt, and whats your point by this? U think just becuz I have Indian Ancestry that someone in my generation was forced to convert. Nah man, I doubt it. Islam is the fastest growing religion in the world Pratik with an annual growth of 2.3% a year. The world grows at an annual rate of 2.9% a year. Therefore Many people are becoming accepting of Islam. And likewise, Dont tell one side to the story. U dont think Hindus criticize us Muslims? Do you not look at the Kashmir Incident involving both sides? Get your facts straight son.

[dEsI_sHeR86]

Besides Hollister Desi

the Muslim percentage in the Indian subcontinent was never as high as it is today. The reason for the current high percentage has little to do with forced conversions or genuine conversions, it is simply due to one criteria:

The High birth rates of Muslim women.

to give you an idea, note that the Muslim percentage in the entire Subcontinent was 20% in 1900, and has swelled to 35% today.

I remember reading a verse in the Quran that said to bear many children, the problem is they do it at the cost of poverty and a hope to one day turn the world Islamic through more partitions, India was 25% Muslims when it was partitioned, today the subcontinent is 33% Muslim due to pig-breeding.

[typeOnegative]

"India does not reserve jobs for Muslims"

-not for now at least. Andrah Pradesh may in the near future have jobs reserved for Muslims in - of all places- the private sector! And of course we already have reservation of university seats for Muslims.So why bring up something that has not happened? And seats are reserved for Muslims in Muslim institutions ... which is okay I think.

[typeOnegative]

today the subcontinent is 33% Muslim due to pig-breeding.Why do you hate so much?
:no:

[typeOnegative]

Pratik, even though u r very friendly, ur a complete idiot. Islam derived from not wanting to worship statutes and idols u fool. Many people questioned before 600 AD whether or not they want to worship rocks or manmade creatures. Thus, Islam was revealed back then. Also, Hinduism is a polythestic religion, they believe in more than 1 god. With Ganesh, Shiva, Vishnu, Rama, Brahma, and the other Gods you guys worship. Many Muslims didnt believe in that concept. And now u tell me that they were forced to convert in that era, no they werent forced to convert back then. The Quran was revealed back then and it started to grow rapidly. Also, I dont know anything about economic pressure that took place between India and Pakistan, therefore its not my place to comment. But I can say, to embrace a religion has to come from the heart. They can easily say we're one religion, but truly in their hearts only God knows their intentions. Do you know whatI mean? If people were forced to convert back then, accepting a religion comes from the heart man. Also, You think you know everything, but essentially you dont. Islam does not consider *haram* if other people dont accept Islam as the only religion or whatever BS logic u just gave. I advise U to pick up the Quran and read instead of posting a forum in which u have no knowledge to speak or even comment about. Islam is unity, peace, and harmony man. They are very understanding of other religions, but yes, when living in an oppressed society where U cant practice your religious beliefs, then yes it does say in the Quran to take action towards it, which isnt wrong. So dont say Islam considers it haram, b/c it doesnt. I doubt u have even picked up the Quran and even read a couple of verses. Also, I will admit my ancestry is from India. No Doubt, and whats your point by this? U think just becuz I have Indian Ancestry that someone in my generation was forced to convert. Nah man, I doubt it. Islam is the fastest growing religion in the world Pratik with an annual growth of 2.3% a year. The world grows at an annual rate of 2.9% a year. Therefore Many people are becoming accepting of Islam. And likewise, Dont tell one side to the story. U dont think Hindus criticize us Muslims? Do you not look at the Kashmir Incident involving both sides? Get your facts straight son.
Nice ... though I do believe that forced/co-erced conversions did happen. Not that it matters now.

[dEsI_sHeR86]

I think that paying for the 'Haj' (not Eid pilgrimage) is wrong and a secular country (at least in theory) should not do that. But you are wrong on the job reservation part. India does not reserve jobs for Muslims. And countries in the Gulf are reserving jobs for their natives - who happen to be Muslims ....

in Delhi Eid is the time muslims go for haj, whats this gulf talk have to do with anything, in AP muslims have a specified percentage of job reservations because they're a poor minority group

[typeOnegative]

Islam is the fastest growing religion, but not because many people are accepting it. Its because Muslims breed at a higher rate than any other religious groups.
That I think is a very valid point.

[typeOnegative]

why bring it up?

Because it shows the political climate in India, a climate that has existed for a long time now, ever since the Lucknow Pact - a climate of appeasement to the Minorities.

Consider one other fact, that of minority religious institutions receiving funds from the government and not having to pay taxes. While Hindu religious instutions are milked clean - acc. to Ravi Shankar, in 2002, Karnataka's temples income was Rs 400 million, Rs395 of which had to be given to the state government.You are right. The so called appeasement has to go. And if temples are taxed, then mosques and churches should be taxed too. But give me rational method of doing that (without the Hindu angle) and I will welcome it.

[typeOnegative]

So the job reservation in AP is now a law?
Not that I am aware of ...

[dEsI_sHeR86]

Why do you hate so much?
:no:

It's an expression and i don't hate, i turn my head or act.

[MolviCorleone]

this thread was really stupid.......it is based on what a few idiots say about india and hinduz.....that dont mean u create a thread about muslims hating indians....

[typeOnegative]

in Delhi Eid is the time muslims go for haj, whats this gulf talk have to do with anything, in AP muslims have a specified percentage of job reservations because they're a poor minority groupSo is the reservation because of them being Muslims or them being a poor minority group? And what about reservations for Dalits (who are primarily Hindus)? I am opposed to reservations of any kind btw.

not even Islamic countries pay for Eid pilgrimage and job reservations just for being MuslimYour post mentions Islamic countries and hence I brought up the Gulf. If you do not like ot be proved wrong, then stay out.

[typeOnegative]

this thread was really stupid.......it is based on what a few idiots say about india and hinduz.....that dont mean u create a thread about muslims hating indians....
Well a thread can be created. If you do not like it then stay out. :)

[typeOnegative]

instead of a Hindu angle we should talk about the Muslim angle. Because it is the Muslim angle that drove and keeps in place these sort of laws. Its simple. Politicians want the Muslim vote. Even the so-called Hindutvadi party the BJP got on their knees for Muslim votes in the last election (worst political decision ever)

None of these laws will be changed because then certain political parties will lose the votes of certain peopleThe Hindu angle always brings up the Muslim angle. Why cant you talk about Indians instead of Hindus and Muslims? Politicians will not want the Muslim votes if Muslims are economically stronger. Because that is when Muslims will vote for business instead of voting for a party that helps keep them in the ghetto.

[typeOnegative]

It's an expression and i don't hate, i turn my head or act.
Act on the Internet?

[dEsI_sHeR86]

So is the reservation because of them being Muslims or them being a poor minority group? And what about reservations for Dalits (who are primarily Hindus)? I am opposed to reservations of any kind btw.

Your post mentions Islamic countries and hence I brought up the Gulf. If you do not like ot be proved wrong, then stay out.

I'm also opposed to reservations, reservations should see no religion but who's truely in poverty and work hard.. and what you said about Arab countries was baseless, my point was that Indian politics kiss minority ass.

[adren@line]

Pratik, even though u r very friendly, ur a complete idiot. Islam derived from not wanting to worship statutes and idols u fool. Many people questioned before 600 AD whether or not they want to worship rocks or manmade creatures. Thus, Islam was revealed back then. Also, Hinduism is a polythestic religion, they believe in more than 1 god. With Ganesh, Shiva, Vishnu, Rama, Brahma, and the other Gods you guys worship. Many Muslims didnt believe in that concept. And now u tell me that they were forced to convert in that era, no they werent forced to convert back then. The Quran was revealed back then and it started to grow rapidly. Also, I dont know anything about economic pressure that took place between India and Pakistan, therefore its not my place to comment. But I can say, to embrace a religion has to come from the heart. They can easily say we're one religion, but truly in their hearts only God knows their intentions. Do you know whatI mean? If people were forced to convert back then, accepting a religion comes from the heart man. Also, You think you know everything, but essentially you dont. Islam does not consider *haram* if other people dont accept Islam as the only religion or whatever BS logic u just gave. I advise U to pick up the Quran and read instead of posting a forum in which u have no knowledge to speak or even comment about. Islam is unity, peace, and harmony man. They are very understanding of other religions, but yes, when living in an oppressed society where U cant practice your religious beliefs, then yes it does say in the Quran to take action towards it, which isnt wrong. So dont say Islam considers it haram, b/c it doesnt. I doubt u have even picked up the Quran and even read a couple of verses. Also, I will admit my ancestry is from India. No Doubt, and whats your point by this? U think just becuz I have Indian Ancestry that someone in my generation was forced to convert. Nah man, I doubt it. Islam is the fastest growing religion in the world Pratik with an annual growth of 2.3% a year. The world grows at an annual rate of 2.9% a year. Therefore Many people are becoming accepting of Islam. And likewise, Dont tell one side to the story. U dont think Hindus criticize us Muslims? Do you not look at the Kashmir Incident involving both sides? Get your facts straight son.


lol.

Your idiotic concepts of monotheism and polytheism do not apply to Hinduism.

I love when Muslims talk about idols and "man-made" things when one of the largest and most worshipped idols on the face of the earth is the Kabbah.

[typeOnegative]

I'm also opposed to reservations, reservations should see no religion but who's truely in poverty and work hard.. and what you said about Arab countries was baseless, my point was that Indian politics kiss minority ass.Dude I got your point ... but

Your post mentions Islamic countries

[typeOnegative]

More than valid, it is practically earth shattering...especially if you live in Europe

hahaha. These next 20 years will be very interesting
Clash of the Civilizations? Hmm ... sad but me thinks it is kind of inevitable.

[MolviCorleone]

lol.

Your idiotic concepts of monotheism and polytheism do not apply to Hinduism.

I love when Muslims talk about idols and "man-made" things when one of the largest and most worshipped idols on the face of the earth is the Kabbah.

dumbass u must be going fucking blind shagging cows......does the kaaba look liek an idol........does it have a face??........It is important to note that though Muslims face the Kaaba during prayers, they do not worship the Kaaba. Muslims worship and bow to none but Allah. "We see the turning of thy face (for guidance) to the heavens: now shall We turn thee to a Qiblah that shall please thee. Turn then thy face in the direction of the Sacred Mosque: wherever ye are, turn your faces in that direction." [Al-Qur’an 2:144] And there are loads of other reasons like Islam believes in fostering unity : In order to unite Muslims in their worship of the One True God, Muslims, wherever they may be, are asked to face in only one direction i.e. towards the Kaaba. Kaaba is at the Centre of the World Map : The Muslims were the first people to draw the map of the world. They drew the map with the south facing upwards and north downwards. The Kaaba was at the centre. Later, western cartographers drew the map upside down with the north facing upwards and south downwards. Yet, Alhamdullilah the Kaaba is at the centre of the world map. Tawaaf around Kaaba for indicating one God : When the Muslims go to Masjid-e-Haram in Makkah, they perform tawaaf or circumambulation round the Kaaba. This act symbolizes the belief and worship of One God, since, just as every circle has one centre, so also there is only one Allah (swt) worthy of worship

[dEsI_sHeR86]

Movli u Muslims squat 5times a day to Kaba and u have the nerve to make fun of Hindus using images of god to pray?

[no_coast_desi]

you can believe that forced conversions happened, but like i said....to believe in a religion has to come from the heart. You can proclaim a faith to a religion if someones makes you or forces you, but only God or whatever higher being u believe in knows your true intentions....I advise many of you guys to do actual research about Islam instead of making random stuff up. I dont have nothing against hinduism, likewise I am sure there are hindus who feel about the same for Muslims. I am tolerant of other religions..But for that desi sher dude to say That Islam considers it haram to not accept any other religions has no basis. He is making a judgment based on a whole religion..which leads to unwanted rumors and beliefs. Therefore, I urge you to do actual research about the religion and do one thing foremost: Pick up a Quran and read it
Also We dont pray to the Kabba, we pray towards it. Desi Sher, ur an ignorant, close minded fool. Please Research before making a post.

[MolviCorleone]

Movli u Muslims squat 5times a day to Kaba and u have the nerve to make fun of Hindus using images of god to pray?

read the text u stupid fool.........we pray in one direction, we pray to one god, we are ONE..we are united. It would be unrealistic for a religion that bases itself around the idea of ONE having its followrs facing anywhere doing prayers. The Kaabah is a symbol of our unity. It was created a long long time ago and was even taken over by idol worshippers.......they were just liek you........the city is called Mecca which means magnet and that city draws in millions each year for the Hajj.......the city was once pue desert with no life there and it developed into what it is now becuase if the Zamm Zam water. That city is a sign of Allahs blessings and is a symbol of our unity.

[typeOnegative]

you can believe that forced conversions happened,
So you say, forced conversions did not occur? :)

[dEsI_sHeR86]

read the text u stupid fool.........we pray in one direction, we pray to one god, we are ONE..we are united. It would be unrealistic for a religion that bases itself around the idea of ONE having its followrs facing anywhere doing prayers. The Kaabah is a symbol of our unity. It was created a long long time ago and was even taken over by idol worshippers.......they were just liek you........the city is called Mecca which means magnet and that city draws in millions each year for the Hajj.......the city was once pue desert with no life there and it developed into what it is now becuase if the Zamm Zam water. That city is a sign of Allahs blessings and is a symbol of our unity.

no shit

[typeOnegative]

read the text u stupid fool.........we pray in one direction, we pray to one god, we are ONE..we are united. It would be unrealistic for a religion that bases itself around the idea of ONE having its followrs facing anywhere doing prayers. The Kaabah is a symbol of our unity. It was created a long long time ago and was even taken over by idol worshippers.......they were just liek you........the city is called Mecca which means magnet and that city draws in millions each year for the Hajj.......the city was once pue desert with no life there and it developed into what it is now becuase if the Zamm Zam water. That city is a sign of Allahs blessings and is a symbol of our unity.Wow ... but do you really require to look in one direction? Isn't that mere symbolism? And if is, then why be against the idol worship? It is mere symbolism too. ;)

[MolviCorleone]

this whole thread is a joke......im here becuase i dont want ppl to come along and diiss my religion with no meaning behind it. Theres a lot of arseholes on this site. In reality they know they cannot do anything about muslim growth and need to use filthy language in reference to muslims growing. I just hate ppl who create this hatred. If u feel we hate you for the wrong reasons then why not educate us. Teeling a pakistani to stop hating india becuase the pakistaniz were once indians is a dumb logic.....f u have the same ethnicity it doesnt mean ur going to luv each other. Pakistanis do and dont liek india...iit just depends on thier own personal views.....personally i dont hatew india and would even go as far as to say that pakistan should never have been created.........but thats another topic.....

[typeOnegative]

"The Hindu angle always brings up the Muslim angle."

not in this case at all. The muslim angle (appeasement for votes) brings about the Hindu "angle" which is nothing but a reaction towards that appeasement. Why do you think the BJP went from having only 2 seats in 1984 to ruling the country in 1999? Of course now that the BJP has proven its "secular" credentials by engaging in the customary appeasement, Hindus will have to look elsewhere

"Politicians will not want the Muslim votes if Muslims are economically stronger. "

faulty logic. If a group of peoples show that they will en masse vote for the same political party no matter how rich they are, then the politicians will still beg for their votes. I highly doubt an increase in the economic status of the Muslim community will cause them to not vote in line with what their Islamic clerics want them to. To examine a similar argument, people have often talked about terrorism being a byproduct of poverty, when the obvious counterargument to that is the identity of the 9/11 hijackers, 15 out of 16 from prosperous Saudi.Yaar you are not getting my point.

Appeasements have to go. I agree. But not because Hindus are not getting appeased, but because appeasement is not fair. If India did not have many economic problems, there would be no backlash. The US has appeasement which is called Affirmative Action. Can you see any backlash there?

The reason I am saying that Msulims have to be economically stronger is that as long as they are backward, they will always listen to the mullahs. Your statement on the 9/11 hijackers is very interesting .... maybe the Saudi version of the religion is such. But I think that the Indian Muslim is quite a bit different from his Saudi / Wahabi counterpart. Call that blind faith or something else. :)

[MolviCorleone]

Wow ... but do you really require to look in one direction? Isn't that mere symbolism? And if is, then why be against the idol worship? It is mere symbolism too. ;)


do you have 1 symbol....or like a said before...millions......and we have one.....we dont sybolise the Kaaba as god......we dont look at it and think that is a symbol of god.....we look at it as a symbol of muslim unity not as a symbol of god......think about it....and dont hate

[typeOnegative]

this whole thread is a joke......im here becuase i dont want ppl to come along and diiss my religion with no meaning behind it. Theres a lot of arseholes on this site. In reality they know they cannot do anything about muslim growth and need to use filthy language in reference to muslims growing. I just hate ppl who create this hatred. If u feel we hate you for the wrong reasons then why not educate us. Teeling a pakistani to stop hating india becuase the pakistaniz were once indians is a dumb logic.....f u have the same ethnicity it doesnt mean ur going to luv each other. Pakistanis do and dont liek india...iit just depends on thier own personal views.....personally i dont hatew india and would even go as far as to say that pakistan should never have been created.........but thats another topic.....No body was dissing your religion ... :) They were dissing guys from your community. And damn, you can create a thread too. This is the net stupid. :lol:

[typeOnegative]

do you have 1 symbol....or like a said before...millions......and we have one.....we dont sybolise the Kaaba as god......we dont look at it and think that is a symbol of god.....we look at it as a symbol of muslim unity not as a symbol of god......think about it....and dont hateOne symbol, many symbols ... a symbol is a symbol. And dude, I am not hating. You may not think that the Kaaba is Allah, but will you take it if anyone disrespects it?

[typeOnegative]

" The US has appeasement which is called Affirmative Action. Can you see any backlash there?"

Sure, and many affirmative action laws have gone away, via Political avenues. Do you see the difference between the situations?

Yaaar
So the appeasement in India has to change politically no? :) And maturely. Not because of hate. Yaar. :)

[typeOnegative]

So did the Koran change along the way from Sadui to India?

And btw, just where do you think the Mullahs get their message from?Ever heard of Sufism? They follow the Koran too. Tell me if there is any Sufi fundamentalist you have come across.

Islam in India is different because of Hinduism. Sufism started because of Hinduism. Got it?

[typeOnegative]

"So the appeasement in India has to change politically no? And maturely. Not because of hate"

but its not going to change politically, because it is too embedded into the current system. But there are other options.And the other options are? Riots? Rape and murder? :) Cool ...

[MolviCorleone]

One symbol, many symbols ... a symbol is a symbol. And dude, I am not hating. You may not think that the Kaaba is Allah, but will you take it if anyone disrespects it?

well that happned when the prophet was a child the place was full of idols but islam stopped that and removed the idols inside it and made it into a centre of islamic unity. I called it a symbol of islamic unity.....even if the buidling was knocked down we would still worship in that direction. We dont hate you becuase you have idols of your gods......we dont say they are your gods we just say why do you need them idols....your idols have the image of yuor god.....we dont look at the kaaba and seriously think....wow now that is what god looks like astagfirullah the thought doesnt bare thinking about.....but muslims worldwide need a centre of unity.we worship the same godd so why should we face different directions......the kaaba is there to point out the centre....its apoint not a building that we bow down to in worship...when we read we dont imagine the kaabah in front of us.....we just read and think about the wordsa we are saying and we beleive in those words. Lets end this here.....basically the kaaba s a symbol but NOT a symbol of Allah..ve said it again and again now theres not much i should add to this. the other ppl can keep on going if they want to.......

[typeOnegative]

"Ever heard of Sufism? They follow the Koran too. Tell me if there is any Sufi fundamentalist you have come across.

Islam in India is different because of Hinduism. Sufism started because of Hinduism. Got it?"

Actually the Sufis claim to the Islamic fold is based on a Hadith that is not considered to be of the highest authority. Nothing in the Koran, and the vast majority of the Hadiths, support the Sufi claim to be part of the Islamic fold. As you said, their source was a Hindu one.

And since...hmmm....99% of Muslims in the Subcontinent are NOT Sufi, it more a case of the exception proving the rule.But you do agree that Islam in India is different? Or not?

[typeOnegative]

well that ....ve said it again and again now theres not much i should add to this. the other ppl can keep on going if they want to.......
You seem to be balanced ... but others are not. :) This thread was just a question ... and it ended this way. If a similar thread was started by a Muslim it would have ended differently and Pandit corleone would be here instead of you. hope you get what I am saying. :)

[typeOnegative]

Sure, Islam in India is different due to Hinduism, but not enough. And most importantly, contact with Hinduism could never do anything to change the contents in Islamic scripture.
But why would you want to change it? If people are open minded, who gives a hell about religious scripture anyway. I have that much faith in India. :) Only here do you have Muslims selling flowers and sweets outside Hindu temples, Muslims making kites for Hindu festivals. Credit should go to the average Indian(Hindu) who is accepting and tolerant. And the average Muslim is just as appreciative.

Politicians have screwed up big time .... really big time. :(

[MolviCorleone]

But why would you want to change it? If people are open minded, who gives a hell about religious scripture anyway. I have that much faith in India. :) Only here do you have Muslims selling flowers and sweets outside Hindu temples, Muslims making kites for Hindu festivals. Credit should go to the average Indian(Hindu) who is accepting and tolerant. And the average Muslim is just as appreciative.

Politicians have screwed up big time .... really big time. :(

there was a time we had real unity.......there was i remember reading it sumwhere......a long time ago.......every was happy but even the corrupt foolish muslim rulers messed up and discriminated........i dont think we will ever have real unity between hindus and muslims......its just not going to happen......no point arguing about it.......theres always going to be haterz........just try not being of of them........

[typeOnegative]

there was a time we had real unity.......there was i remember reading it sumwhere......a long time ago.......every was happy but even the corrupt foolish muslim rulers messed up and discriminated........i dont think we will ever have real unity between hindus and muslims......its just not going to happen......no point arguing about it.......theres always going to be haterz........just try not being of of them........No. I dont believe that real unity is not possible. It is ... But yeah haters will be around. They have just to be shown their place.
:D

[dEsI_sHeR86]

there was a time we had real unity.......there was i remember reading it sumwhere......a long time ago.......every was happy but even the corrupt foolish muslim rulers messed up and discriminated........i dont think we will ever have real unity between hindus and muslims......its just not going to happen......no point arguing about it.......theres always going to be haterz........just try not being of of them........

Quran: Chapter 9, Verse 5: Then when the Sacred Months have passed, slay the idolators wherever you find them, and capture them and besiege them, and prepare for them each and every ambush. But if they repent and observe the Islamic lifestyle, then leave their way free. Verily, Allah is Oft Forgiving, Most Merciful

[typeOnegative]

Quran: Chapter 9, Verse 5: Then when the Sacred Months have passed, slay the idolators wherever you find them, and capture them and besiege them, and prepare for them each and every ambush. But if they repent and observe the Islamic lifestyle, then leave their way free. Verily, Allah is Oft Forgiving, Most MercifulGot any Praveen Togadia speeches?

[dEsI_sHeR86]

Got any Praveen Togadia speeches?

no but vhp.org or something might have

[typeOnegative]

no but vhp.org or something might have
You obviously did not detect the sarcasm. :)

[slightly_toasted]

are u hindu's still rantin about some of ur cuzin ancestors who converted to islam in the 8th-9th centry. and now their decendents hate u from across the boarder lol haha keep on rantin cuz as u rant more of ur hindu brothers n sisters are convertin to christanity n islam.. :applause:

[paulie walnuts]

are u hindu's still rantin about some of ur cuzin ancestors who converted to islam in the 8th-9th centry. and now their decendents hate u from across the boarder lol haha keep on rantin cuz as u rant more of ur hindu brothers n sisters are convertin to christanity n islam.. :applause:
lol, every time a hindu converts to islam, the average IQ of both the hindu population and muslim population go up. so please, take those 'hindus'...it's a good deal for both parties. :)

[MolviCorleone]

lol, every time a hindu converts to islam, the average IQ of both the hindu population and muslim population go up. so please, take those 'hindus'...it's a good deal for both parties. :)

be real and stop making up bullshit........quit hating and sit down and cool yourself off. Have u ever been directly affected by muslims?.....if the answer is No....then just plz shut the fuck up.

[dj XeNo]

Are they aware of the fact that their families were previously Muslim, and that its an 80% chance that they were converted due to economic pressure (jizya, or giving a poor man money in exchange for conversion), life threats (during times such as the Ghazni invasions, "convert or die"), or for status (converts were promoted to higher Mughal courts)? Jw, cuz many seem oblivious to it.
doesn't mean shit dude. Who knows how far back Islam went in my family. By your logic egyptians should call themselves African.

and where do you get the 80% from ? Just a number you threw out for fun that's based on nothing ?

[paulie walnuts]

be real and stop making up bullshit........quit hating and sit down and cool yourself off. Have u ever been directly affected by muslims?.....if the answer is No....then just plz shut the fuck up.
lol...me cool off? it was a joke, don't kill yourself.

[amirkhan]

i dont seee the point of this thread. ur jus talkin bout a minority of muslims that critisize, when i can say viseversa'.. these kinda threads just create beef tbh

[muslimbeauty06]

why r we talkin abt religion on this site everyone is different religions here?come'on pplz

[hollisterdesi]

this whole thread is a joke......im here becuase i dont want ppl to come along and diiss my religion with no meaning behind it. Theres a lot of arseholes on this site. In reality they know they cannot do anything about muslim growth and need to use filthy language in reference to muslims growing. I just hate ppl who create this hatred. If u feel we hate you for the wrong reasons then why not educate us. Teeling a pakistani to stop hating india becuase the pakistaniz were once indians is a dumb logic.....f u have the same ethnicity it doesnt mean ur going to luv each other. Pakistanis do and dont liek india...iit just depends on thier own personal views.....personally i dont hatew india and would even go as far as to say that pakistan should never have been created.........but thats another topic.....

My crusade is against ignorance and stupidiy, not Islam.

And lol to the ppl who attempting to change the topic of the thread by arguing the legitimacy of Hinduism rather than the reason why many Muslims are oblivious. And no they didnt convert in the 8th century, that wood be like thee 700's. The Mughals started their forced conversion campaign in 1100 with the Ghazni invasions, thats the 12th century, u guys were about 500yrs off in the defense of ur religion. But like I said, no more talk about who's better. THis thread is a discussion on why many Muslims are ignorant of their past.

[adren@line]

dumbass u must be going fucking blind shagging cows......does the kaaba look liek an idol........does it have a face??........It is important to note that though Muslims face the Kaaba during prayers, they do not worship the Kaaba. Muslims worship and bow to none but Allah. "We see the turning of thy face (for guidance) to the heavens: now shall We turn thee to a Qiblah that shall please thee. Turn then thy face in the direction of the Sacred Mosque: wherever ye are, turn your faces in that direction." [Al-Qur’an 2:144] And there are loads of other reasons like Islam believes in fostering unity : In order to unite Muslims in their worship of the One True God, Muslims, wherever they may be, are asked to face in only one direction i.e. towards the Kaaba. Kaaba is at the Centre of the World Map : The Muslims were the first people to draw the map of the world. They drew the map with the south facing upwards and north downwards. The Kaaba was at the centre. Later, western cartographers drew the map upside down with the north facing upwards and south downwards. Yet, Alhamdullilah the Kaaba is at the centre of the world map. Tawaaf around Kaaba for indicating one God : When the Muslims go to Masjid-e-Haram in Makkah, they perform tawaaf or circumambulation round the Kaaba. This act symbolizes the belief and worship of One God, since, just as every circle has one centre, so also there is only one Allah (swt) worthy of worship

lol.

duhhhhh.

I already know why Muslims "worship" the Kabbah, and I pretty much
knew you would give me some long-winded paragraph on its significance.

The bottom line is that it is a black box, a big. black. box. Just as much of an idol as any Hindu idol, which are not big.black.boxes. Your such a dumbass its unbelievable.

Symbolism doesnt exist only in Islam, but in other religions as well (such as Hinduism).

[hollisterdesi]

Owned...

[typeOnegative]

And no they didnt convert in the 8th century, that wood be like thee 700's. The Mughals started their forced conversion campaign in 1100 with the Ghazni invasions, thats the 12th century, Dude, Ghazni was not a Mughal. The first of the Mughals in India was Babar. :)

[hollisterdesi]

I've always seen Ghazni associated with the Mughals. He had a sultanate based in Ghazni, Afghanistan. But in any case, thats when the conversions started.

[typeOnegative]

I've always seen Ghazni associated with the Mughals.
Well you are wrong. :)


He had a sultanate based in Ghazni, Afghanistan. But in any case, thats when the conversions started.That is true, though I would say Islamic influence started much before that ...

[hollisterdesi]

Perhaps. Depends where u draw ur lines for India. Previously Gandhar was also considered a part of India but that has been raped time and again by like Alexander the Great, Middle Eastern Muslims, and every1. Some say Balochistan, and Sindh (for sure) (all the modern day Pakistanlands) were a part of it as well, but they were also previously invaded. Then ppl will say today and consider India's invasion as starting from when Punjab was invaded. But in any case, it wasn't in 700 I'll tell u that.

[hollisterdesi]

"If people are open minded, who gives a hell about religious scripture anyway."

-keep your head in the sand if you want. But it is very simple. The Mullahs are ones who definitely care about religious scripture. And they will follow Islamic scripture to a tee, which involves biding time while their numbers are low. And since they wield a tremendous amount of power, and have created an incredible amount of Madrassas within India for rote memorization of the Koran, there is a definite problem to be fixed.

" Only here do you have Muslims selling flowers and sweets outside Hindu temples, Muslims making kites for Hindu festivals."

-good businessmen, thats what it is. Speaking of Kites, do you realize that the flying of kites in Pakistan is banned because it is considered to be Hindu in origin? Do not forget that in 1940, there was no such thing as a Pakistani muslim, because there was no such thing as Pakistan.

"Politicians have screwed up big time .... really big time. "

-well obviously

Fags....and they wonder why Babri Masjid was destroyed by extremists.

[hollisterdesi]

Hollister Desi isnt far off. The Delhi Sultanate began late in the 12th century by Ghori, not Mahmud Ghaznavi. Ghaznavi set the tone though, with his 17 raids into Hindu territory circa 1000. Prior to that was Bin Quassims invasion shortly after Mohammeds death, which was dealt with quickly.

FO!

I heard 21 times. I also heard that the Hindu king who defeated him 20 times spared him w/o harm every time. and When Ghazni defeated that Hindu king the 21st time by conspiring with local Hindu maharajas, he had his eyes and tongue plucked out. That jerkface. No wonder Indians hate foreigners, its cuz theyre jerks who raped their land and their ppl. God damn.

[hollisterdesi]

i would disagree that India was "raped" by the Greeks. Alexander was soundly defeated, a fact noted by many of the ancient historians like Ptolemy and a fact that even the latest movie does not hide. India also fought off the Huns, a fierce an enemy as any.

The Hindus repelled the first Islamic wave of Bin Quassim, Gaznavi had to settle for raids, and only after being defeated the first time, Ghori came back to set up the Sultanate. And even after that Muslims were never able to get full control of the country. There were always large areas they could never grab, and some areas resisted for centuries, like the South, which held until the fall of Vijayanagar in the 16th century. But by 1700 the tide had turned and the Hindus were back in control of their land. Even places like Bengal which had Muslim rulers in 1750 were only able to maintain that situation because they were paying tribute to the Marathas.

So about 500 years of Muslim rule for chunks of the country, not bad considering the decadent state that India was in prior to their invasions. It could have been worse, it could have been headed the way Europe is headed now.

Good point.

[FLAVA FLAVE]

Well Hinduism Is Da Oldest Religion In Da World Soo Its Obvious Y They Hate It Soo Much.....n As We All No Muslims N Sikhs Came From Hinduism.

[hollisterdesi]

no Chauhan defeated Ghori once, some say he pardoned him, others say Ghori escaped on his horse. Ghori came back and won the second time.

and Gaznavi made 17 profitable (in income and slaves) raids into Hindu territory


they also raped women and took others to their harems (by force)

[FLAVA FLAVE]

Islam definitely did not come from Hinduism. I repeat, it definitely did not come from Hinduism. It came out of the Judeo-Christian framework of the Middle East.

And Sikhism, well I dont want to get into any flame wars with Sikhs. I can agree that they are different religions. The only thing that I don't like from some Sikhs is that this British created lie that the Sikhs were the saviours of India. They did well in Punjab, Sindh, NWFP, and Kashmir but everywhere else it was the Marathas.


thats wat they all say do sum research my frend....at da end there only 1 answer which most muslims n sikhs dont wanna believe.

[typeOnegative]

"If people are open minded, who gives a hell about religious scripture anyway."

-keep your head in the sand if you want. But it is very simple. The Mullahs are ones who definitely care about religious scripture. And they will follow Islamic scripture to a tee, which involves biding time while their numbers are low. And since they wield a tremendous amount of power, and have created an incredible amount of Madrassas within India for rote memorization of the Koran, there is a definite problem to be fixed. If your problem is with the way the Koran is applied, then I am with you. And I feel, that all religion based educational institutions (Hindu, Christian, Sikh, Muslim etc.) have to go. But if you, have problems with the Koran, then well I will have to step back. I do not share the same concerns as you do because all religions have books that are a imperfect.


" Only here do you have Muslims selling flowers and sweets outside Hindu temples, Muslims making kites for Hindu festivals."

-good businessmen, thats what it is. Speaking of Kites, do you realize that the flying of kites in Pakistan is banned because it is considered to be Hindu in origin? Do not forget that in 1940, there was no such thing as a Pakistani muslim, because there was no such thing as Pakistan. I think you did not get what I was trying to convey. And by writing in what you did you are kind of agreeing that if economy and business is the driving force then no one cares if you are Hindu/Muslim. And why do you have to get Pakistan in this discussion?


"Politicians have screwed up big time .... really big time. "

-well obviously
Something we agree on? Good. :)

[typeOnegative]

Fags....and they wonder why Babri Masjid was destroyed by extremists.That is a highly irresponsible statement. :sad:

[typeOnegative]

i would disagree that India was "raped" by the Greeks. Alexander was soundly defeated, a fact noted by many of the ancient historians like Ptolemy and a fact that even the latest movie does not hide. India also fought off the Huns, a fierce an enemy as any. He was defeated once .. by Porus primarily because this was the first time he was up against elephants. But then he came back and defeated Porus. And no India was not raped by the Greeks.


The Hindus repelled the first Islamic wave of Bin Quassim, Gaznavi had to settle for raids, and only after being defeated the first time, Ghori came back to set up the Sultanate. And even after that Muslims were never able to get full control of the country. There were always large areas they could never grab, and some areas resisted for centuries, like the South, which held until the fall of Vijayanagar in the 16th century. But by 1700 the tide had turned and the Hindus were back in control of their land. Even places like Bengal which had Muslim rulers in 1750 were only able to maintain that situation because they were paying tribute to the Marathas. Whoa there! Hindus? Rajputs were Hindus yes. But you are making this a religious conflict for no rhyme or reason. It was Hindus who invited Babar in btw. ;)

[typeOnegative]

"they also raped women and took others to their harems (by force)"

well yea. Why do you think Sati became so popular in India during that time? Have you ever read Timurlane's autobiography (he was a Muslim invader of India in 1399)? You can see a clear example of mass sati due to the invasion
You are amazing! It was not Sati. It was Jauhar/Johar .... :rolleyes:

[carteblanche]

Why would it even matter how and why one's ancestors converted? If the person is happy about his religious affiliation at present, the history is immaterial. It's like the Brits holding a grudge against the Germans because many of them were Nazis once. Forced conversion is never encouraged nor endorsed in Islam. The fact that this did take place at some point in the history is an utter disgrace. But that doesn't mean the Muslims of present day will have to shoulder that.

[typeOnegative]

Why would it even matter how and why one's ancestors converted? If the person is happy about his religious affiliation at present, the history is immaterial. It's like the Brits holding a grudge against the Germans because many of them were Nazis once. Forced conversion is never encouraged nor endorsed in Islam. The fact that this did take place at some point in the history is an utter disgrace. But that doesn't mean the Muslims of present day will have to shoulder that.
Tell them ... :lol:

[hollisterdesi]

He was defeated once .. by Porus primarily because this was the first time he was up against elephants. But then he came back and defeated Porus. And no India was not raped by the Greeks.

Whoa there! Hindus? Rajputs were Hindus yes. But you are making this a religious conflict for no rhyme or reason. It was Hindus who invited Babar in btw. ;)


hahah guys i nvr said greeks raped india. i was just saying the northern and western lands were raped, and ppl such as the greeks and middle easterners invaded. jeez.

And yes the only reason Muslims successfully invaded India was b/c they conspired with Maharajas against other Maharajas. W/o that compliance, invasion would have failed. Also, Indian maharajas failed to form some kind of coalition during such invasions.

That is a highly irresponsible statement. :sad:

I was using a sarcastic/satirical tone difficult to convey thru posting. my apologies. I mean no harm, nor advocate the destruction of any house of worship. I was jus tryin 2 to show that Muslims shood expect that kinda stuff if they're gonna make kite flying illegal b/c of its "Hindu origin". In that case, should they ban all Pakis from getting citizenship? Since theyre also Hindu in origin.

Why would it even matter how and why one's ancestors converted? If the person is happy about his religious affiliation at present, the history is immaterial. It's like the Brits holding a grudge against the Germans because many of them were Nazis once. Forced conversion is never encouraged nor endorsed in Islam. The fact that this did take place at some point in the history is an utter disgrace. But that doesn't mean the Muslims of present day will have to shoulder that.


"Those who forget the past are doomed to repeat it..."

Maybe another group will emerge from one of the world's major religions and retaliate by having conversions on the Muslims. Sure it will be seen as semi-disgraceful as there is no compulsion in any religion, but that will be ouweighed by the number of followers, as in Islam today.

[slightly_toasted]

lol, every time a hindu converts to islam, the average IQ of both the hindu population and muslim population go up. so please, take those 'hindus'...it's a good deal for both parties. :)
haha i can see the fumes commin outta ur hear did you come up with that one urself or did yer whole family have a conferance be4 responding lol

[slightly_toasted]

ur confused repeatin that old line about when musilms converted and forced conversion n that crap if you read some objective material by people who arent bais you'd realize there were very few forced conversion. check ur facts and stop readin the BJPs version of muslim history in india

[amirkhan]

^^^^^^^^^ty

[adren@line]

ur confused repeatin that old line about when musilms converted and forced conversion n that crap if you read some objective material by people who arent bais you'd realize there were very few forced conversion. check ur facts and stop readin the BJPs version of muslim history in india
Read Punjab's history. That area was ripe with forced conversions.

[hollisterdesi]

Read Punjab's history. That area was ripe with forced conversions.


Punjab and Sindh. Then when u got to Hyderabad, it was economic compulsion by the nizam. And in Uttar Pradesh and Bengal, same deal with Punjab type deals also. For Gujarat, I read the offered positions of high importance in the court to converts. In any case yeah.

[slightly_toasted]

Read Punjab's history. That area was ripe with forced conversions.
do you guys get your book shiped UPS from the indian propaganda ministry?

but in any case if and thats a big if you guys are right you guys are cryin about thing that u cant change on the fourm maybe u guys should go back to indian n try to convince muslims that they're ancestors were unjustly and forfully converted maybe they're become hindu's again :nervious:

[hollisterdesi]

do you guys get your book shiped UPS from the indian propaganda ministry?

but in any case if and thats a big if you guys are right you guys are cryin about thing that u cant change on the fourm maybe u guys should go back to indian n try to convince muslims that they're ancestors were unjustly and forfully converted maybe they're become hindu's again :nervious:

I'd say the same thing if I was a Muslim and oblivious of my past.

And since I'm a bears fan, I'd also reject all media and articles that say the bears have sucked more than theyve been good, and say that I'm right. Then I'd advise the other person 2 look into the Bengals history cuz they sucked even more. (parallel to this discussion if u didnt notice)

[arrewah]

mom is arabic and dads family came 4m persia

[Whizkid786]

thats wat they all say do sum research my frend....at da end there only 1 answer which most muslims n sikhs dont wanna believe.
What the hell are you smoking? Islam did not originate in India. So you're saying every religion in the world originated from Hinduism? :Pukeright

[hollisterdesi]

What the hell are you smoking? Islam did not originate in India. So you're saying every religion in the world originated from Hinduism? :Pukeright


yes :evil:

[FLAVA FLAVE]

What the hell are you smoking? Islam did not originate in India. So you're saying every religion in the world originated from Hinduism? :Pukeright


REALLY DONT DA TRUTH HURT LIKE A MADAFUCKERR! :grin:

[arrewah]

wtf islam came 4m hinduism r u high

islam 4m middleast where alld a 3 main religions came 4m jew christian and islam 3 religon that belive in same god

[arrewah]

muslims own bollywood :cool:

[hollisterdesi]

muslims own bollywood :cool:

Indian Muslims > All other Muslims

APJ Abdul Kalam > All other Muslims

Why? Because they retain many of our customs and practices, so its all good. They're Hindo-Muslim culture-wise.

And btw, its 1 2 guys that are good in Bollywood, the rest is dominated by those native to Indic religions. SRK and Salman. Thats it. Dont say Aamir lol he aint big. But anyways yeah....did I forget to mention AISH WHO OWNS THE WORLD!

[FLAVA FLAVE]

Indian Muslims > All other Muslims

APJ Abdul Kalam > All other Muslims

Why? Because they retain many of our customs and practices, so its all good. They're Hindo-Muslim culture-wise.

And btw, its 1 2 guys that are good in Bollywood, the rest is dominated by those native to Indic religions. SRK and Salman. Thats it. Dont say Aamir lol he aint big. But anyways yeah....did I forget to mention AISH WHO OWNS THE WORLD!


its weird how sum muslims wanna own everthing....as for indians perfect example....

indian PM sikh
indian president muslim

u think pakistan can eva hav a indian or sikh pm........they prolly slaughter u for sayin it.

[adren@line]

do you guys get your book shiped UPS from the indian propaganda ministry?

but in any case if and thats a big if you guys are right you guys are cryin about thing that u cant change on the fourm maybe u guys should go back to indian n try to convince muslims that they're ancestors were unjustly and forfully converted maybe they're become hindu's again :nervious:

so are you saying that the Mughals did not kill a Sikh guru because he refused to convert to Islam? (one of many occurances)?

[paulie walnuts]

haha i can see the fumes commin outta ur hear did you come up with that one urself or did yer whole family have a conferance be4 responding lol
^prime example of my IQ assessment

[hollisterdesi]

I thot they killed 2...


And to the Muslims who cant comprehend the disastrous effects of such an act. Imagine Mohammed or one of the 4 caliphs being kidnapped by their worst enemies (lets say a radical regime of Hindus for example) and tortured them and eventually killed them. Here are some things done to the gurus, now imagine it done to a caliph or the prophet. Is it not horendous? So why do you ignore what happened?

Putting burning hot sand on your back

Putting a person in a live burning pot of oil

Making a person lay down on a heated sheet of metal

Have eyes and tongue gouged out (not done to a guru, but followers of his yes)

Be scalped

Have family raped in front of you and relatives killed in front of u (Mohammed also had a family right?)

The reason I bring this example is not to insult u, b/c I have no reason to. But I want to show you how bad and barbaric the Mughals were by putting it in an example YOU can relate to. Now apply the grief to India. So why do most Indians hate Mughals?

[typeOnegative]

:? Mughals? What about the Huns? Ever heard of Mrihakula, Asoka, Sasanka? Kanishka?

[hollisterdesi]

Ever heard of, a large fraction of my people didn't lose their identity and culture to a Hun empire hellbent and making us just like them even against our will. We don't worship a plethera of Germanic Gods, we have a singular Hindu god, whether or not Muslims accept that or not is not my concern, I can care less.

They didnt have as much an effect on us as the Mughals did

[Reaper]

Are they aware of the fact that their families were previously Muslim

No.

[Z4K5T4R]

Pratik, even though u r very friendly, ur a complete idiot. Islam derived from not wanting to worship statutes and idols u fool. Many people questioned before 600 AD whether or not they want to worship rocks or manmade creatures. Thus, Islam was revealed back then. Also, Hinduism is a polythestic religion, they believe in more than 1 god. With Ganesh, Shiva, Vishnu, Rama, Brahma, and the other Gods you guys worship. Many Muslims didnt believe in that concept. And now u tell me that they were forced to convert in that era, no they werent forced to convert back then. The Quran was revealed back then and it started to grow rapidly. Also, I dont know anything about economic pressure that took place between India and Pakistan, therefore its not my place to comment. But I can say, to embrace a religion has to come from the heart. They can easily say we're one religion, but truly in their hearts only God knows their intentions. Do you know whatI mean? If people were forced to convert back then, accepting a religion comes from the heart man. Also, You think you know everything, but essentially you dont. Islam does not consider *haram* if other people dont accept Islam as the only religion or whatever BS logic u just gave. I advise U to pick up the Quran and read instead of posting a forum in which u have no knowledge to speak or even comment about. Islam is unity, peace, and harmony man. They are very understanding of other religions, but yes, when living in an oppressed society where U cant practice your religious beliefs, then yes it does say in the Quran to take action towards it, which isnt wrong. So dont say Islam considers it haram, b/c it doesnt. I doubt u have even picked up the Quran and even read a couple of verses. Also, I will admit my ancestry is from India. No Doubt, and whats your point by this? U think just becuz I have Indian Ancestry that someone in my generation was forced to convert. Nah man, I doubt it. Islam is the fastest growing religion in the world Pratik with an annual growth of 2.3% a year. The world grows at an annual rate of 2.9% a year. Therefore Many people are becoming accepting of Islam. And likewise, Dont tell one side to the story. U dont think Hindus criticize us Muslims? Do you not look at the Kashmir Incident involving both sides? Get your facts straight son.


oH MY GAWD! U soooooo have da brainz, Clever u :cop:

[Reaper]

Pratik, even though u r very friendly, ur a complete idiot.

You shouldn't treat friendly people in such fashion.

[sickyricky87]

You shouldn't treat friendly people in such fashion.
hahahah

[MR2Turbo]

My ancestors werent from India and were Muslims since the start, so I dont give a fuck about your lame arguments.

[HeRsHeE317]

Are they aware of the fact that their families were previously Muslim, and that its an 80% chance that they were converted due to economic pressure (jizya, or giving a poor man money in exchange for conversion), life threats (during times such as the Ghazni invasions, "convert or die"), or for status (converts were promoted to higher Mughal courts)? Jw, cuz many seem oblivious to it.
see i ahte bein sterotyped cuz im mulima nd im indian
so wen ppl find out im muslim...they think paki
and wen they find out im indian..they think im hindu
:?
i hate that

[flash_sav]

Eh... I haven't read through every single post, so I dunno if this was already brought up, but the fact is that if you're going to assume that most Muslims in India were converted by force, then most Christians around the world were converted by force too. So what, does that not make them Christians? Because their ancestors were converted by force? The fact is that NOW they are Christians, and if they are not happy, then they convert. Same with the Muslims. And no one is denying that that happened, so yeah, happy? Yes it did happen, I admit, but that doesn't make them any less of Muslims now.

[fazool]

in complete agreement.