How Pakistani Punjabis percieve Sikh Girls?

[BindaasBapu]

How Pakistani Punjabis Perceive Sikh Girls?

Source: http://intellibriefs.blogspot.com/2006/06/how-pakistani-punjabis-perceive-sikh.html

I had decided a while ago that I should write this e-mail, but other things always came first. Today i read something very shocking on an e-group, about bibian going out with muslim boys. What was most shocking was that people on the group just seemed to accept this. But can I ask why do we accept this?

In the last few years, I have become quite involved with some of these situations, not intentionally, but by accident. As some of you may know I now live in Leeds, which is right next to Bradford (Mini-Pakistan). Over the last year, when I went to some of the local Gurdwaras ( there are many), I would occasionally get distraught parents come up to me telling me to talk to their children. The reason they asked me, because I can speak english, british-born sikh, who attempts to practice. It started off with one girl who said she madly wants to marry a muslim boy, her parents will not agree, so they brought her to talk to me. Naturally I was a bit shocked, but I spoke to her at the gurdwara. She told me how much they loved each other, she was going to convert and they were going to marry. I asked her if he really did love her. She said yes. I said, "You are going to convert for him, out of love. I do not ask him to take Amrit, but will he, out of love for you, just come to the gurdwara, and just bow in front of Sahib Siri Guru Granth sahib ji. Surely if you can convert for him, he can do this much for you?"

To cut the story short, he would not. She stuck by him, two weeks later ran off with him. They were not seen for six weeks, until she came home, after he had dumped her for another girl. Two other cases came to me, different in structure, but similar storyline. Eventually, I thought enough is enough. I went on the gurdwara stage and spoke about muslims, panjabi girls, fundamental muslim groups, etc. Guru Maharaj de kirpa, the sangat responded, an ever-expanding youth group has been set-up, we did the shabad-Guru samagam,which included a youth camp,in which this subject was particularly discussed. Now the youth are getting ready to create mass education on Sikhi in this area, as this was seen as a starting point.

I KNOW THIS IS A LONG E-MAIL, BUT IMPORTANT. PLEASE READ ON.

Since the smamgam, because of the camp I have had another 4 cases. I know maharaj will help all those who need it. But I have noticed a pattern which i what I want to share. Every situation is different, different ages, environment, etc. But one fundamental pattern.

There are two types of muslim boys;
FUNDAMENTAL MUSLIM - these usually belong to particular groups. They do not care for the individuals, they look at who she is. They target sikh,hindu,christain and jewish girls. Romancing, flattery, games, etc, to get these in girls in their circle, leading towards conversion. Shocking as it may seem these boys truely believe if they convert a non-muslim into Islam, then they will be Mukt. (Liberated)
NON-RELIGIOUS MUSLIMS - they care little about religion, for them it is a social thing. If they go out with pakistani girls and get them pregnent, their community forces them to get married. They do not want to get married, but just go with girls. So they INTENTIONALLY pick sikh/hindu/white girls, because they can do what they want, there is no comeback. If the girls get pregnent, their community does not care, these are just cheap girls for their boys to use as they grow up. They are not pakistani muslim girls, who are pure. hence the pakistani community a major superiority complex over the others.

PUNJABI GIRLS - Notice i call them punjabi, because they have little knowledge on Sikhi, and no practice. The pattern I have found in the girls is what i call the "Bollywood Concept". These girls wholeheartedly believe love will conquer all. As in films, there is a social divide, their parents are against it, their community is against, but no matter love will always win. However these poor girls get a reality check, when the boy`s sisters, mother and other family do not want this "cheap" girl" in their family. Or the boy has had his fun and wants to move on to the next girl, or get maried to a respectable girl. Love suddenly disappears, and she is left humilliated in front of her friends, family and community FOR LIFE, because people do not forget.

I am not racist. I know punjabi boys are just as bad. But we as a community have got to look at how muslims percieve us. They do target punjabi girls, because they are considered easy. Many years ago, A hindu brahmin journalist wrote in a national newspaper, "The Daily Telegraph" that sikh girls are the most uninhibited, ie.(cheap), in the asian community. Fundamental muslim do target sikh girls, they are desparate for a dastaar wale girl just to humiliate sikhs. How are we as a community reacting. Why do we accept this? Why are our girls so niave that they think everything is so innocent. Why do they play games?

the muslim community here, has a major problem of pakistani girls running away with non-muslims, due to seeing the hypocrisy and attitudes of muslims boys. However the are trying to tackle the situation, hence have a £5million pound grant for a school for muslim girls.

We as sikhs look at Sarbat da bhalla (consideration for all mankind). But we also have realise not everyone else is like that. We as a community cannot tolerate our community to be precieved in this way. We are not cheap or asain trash. The sikh community should be the most moral, upstanding, hardworking, civilised and sophisticated society as created by our Guru`s. THAT IS OUR STANDARD.

A benti to everyone, have some self-respect! Especially to all the Bibian, do not let girls who are your friends behave like this. Say something. Educate them. It is not innocently going to the cinema with some boys, who happen to be muslims. The deeper they go the more they get burned.

I know alot of people may not like this e-mail, or will disagree with it. Some people may say there is not a problem. If you go to any college, uni, etc, you will see there is a problem. DO YOUR COMMUNITY A FAVOUR, DO NOT ACCEPT IT!!!!!

Source: http://intellibriefs.blogspot.com/2006/06/how-pakistani-punjabis-perceive-sikh.html

I came across this blog and thought it would be a good conversation and would help spread awareness.

[BigCrazyIndian]

lol @ anti-paki camp. I bet they have sashes, badges, and pedophilic leaders like the boy-scouts.

but yay for cheap, easy sikh girls! :cheers:

[di vinci]

:rofl: some funny shit

[BadFingerBoogie]

you're english, that's your first problem.

[di vinci]

rd and its long list of weirdo

[shadds]

you're english, that's your first problem.

LOL

[King Ghidra]

I regulary fuck girls of every race/religion and leave them for dead.


SEE! I'm so much better than these other guys.

[reaz]

There are 3 types of Muslim boys.

You forgot the "blow yourself up to get 72 virgins" type.

[nikefc7]

th sikh community in the uk needs to get one thing through their thick heads. pakistani muslims alone are to blame for getting your women pregnant its your women opening their legs too.

no this may sound harsh but its not like the pakistani men in the uk are going around raping your women against their will. your women that get pregnant are just as stupid as the pakistani men that have sex with them in the first place.

its about time you people get your heads out of your asses and realise that the reason why you have this problem is because its a failing on your side of the community for not giving your girls a good religious upbringing, in the same way these pakistani men havent been given a good islamic upbringing.

instead of coming up with these bullshit theories and pointing fingers its high time you guys start looking into your community and its failings.

[BindaasBapu]

Every year 100,000 Hindu & Sikh girls are eloping with muslims by way of rape & blackmail.
Reader comment on article: The Travails of Brooklyn's Arabic Academy
in response to reader comment: not new

Submitted by Nisha (India), May 29, 2007 at 09:57

I agree with you . As an Indian living in capital Delhi , I know many cases where Muslims posing as Hindu boys meet and date educated Hindu / Sikh girls , they are show their love and care , As soon as the girl agrees to go to date with a muslim boy , he give them drugs ( sleeping pills) in tea / coffee and gang rape them as soon as they are unconscious. They take their nude photos and video movies. They show them when they are conscious and blackmail them to be exploited physically and financially. They even order them to bring few of their friends ( girls) along with them next time. They repeat the same thing with their friends as well. The racket grows.

There have been so many cases. Unlike West , The girls will not open her mouth and tell to her family because of the fear of family elders. Even if some girl will tell her family members , they will try to keep her silent becasue this exposure can do damage to family prestige and honour. In the end the girl is badly exploited . Either she is converted to Islam and made muslim. Or she is sold to the prostitute pimps ( who are muslims majority) for prostitution . The money they get is used to lure and trap new girls to repeat the same menace. In public the girl is forced to give statements in favour of Islam and she is even forced to confess that she loves so and so muslim boy and she willingly went with him because muslim boys and his friends threaten her to do so and they also do Islamic Ritual Slaughter ( Halal) of animals in front of her and threaten her that If she dare to open her mouth in front of police , media or anyone else , They will make sure that she and her family members are also murdered in the same cruel way.............

This is the real story of thousands of Indian ( Non Muslim ) girls. I know this because two of my friends suffered this hell . One of them was forced to convert to Islam and produce dozen kids and pray five times to allah . Second friend committed suicide. I wrote to many influential people and media but they are afraid to take up the issue as muslims are involved in this episode and taking this issue can prompt any Mulla to give a call of Jehad to his Friday worshippers and his office can be ransacked and he can be murdered in broad daylight. and Politicians don't wont to speak any word because they are afraid of loosing muslim votes because 200 million muslims in India are almost 20 % and they vote en masse and this matters a lot in Democracy like India.............

This could be happen to any girl now ...........and its growing in almost every city.

source: http://www.danielpipes.org/comments/95111

[BindaasBapu]

th sikh community in the uk needs to get one thing through their thick heads. pakistani muslims alone are to blame for getting your women pregnant its your women opening their legs too.

no this may sound harsh but its not like the pakistani men in the uk are going around raping your women against their will. your women that get pregnant are just as stupid as the pakistani men that have sex with them in the first place.

its about time you people get your heads out of your asses and realise that the reason why you have this problem is because its a failing on your side of the community for not giving your girls a good religious upbringing, in the same way these pakistani men havent been given a good islamic upbringing.

instead of coming up with these bullshit theories and pointing fingers its high time you guys start looking into your community and its failings.

I think the main problem is that our Hindu and Sikh girls have this preconceived notion that Muslim guys are all tough because they are all Jihadis so being with them they will get more attention.. and we all know how attention-cravy our girls are. It's kind of like white girls wanting "black dick"... you know... blacks are views as THUGS-- in the same manner muslims are viewed as such-- so our girls really just want to be with Thugs.. and that's the problem.

[di vinci]

Every year 100,000 Hindu & Sikh girls are eloping with muslims by way of rape & blackmail:roflwtf:
idiot

he banned too

[uk finest]

all guys are horny bastards,now if the gals had any sense they shud know not to shag any dude,1st they shud say,marry me if u love me then sexy time,rather than be sweet talked into bed!!!!!!

[nikefc7]

I think the main problem is that our Hindu and Sikh girls have this preconceived notion that Muslim guys are all tough because they are all Jihadis so being with them they will get more attention.. and we all know how attention-cravy our girls are. It's kind of like white girls wanting "black dick"... you know... blacks are views as THUGS-- in the same manner muslims are viewed as such-- so our girls really just want to be with Thugs.. and that's the problem.

yeah spot on.
We all know the mind of a woman, sikh or otherwise. potrays herself as an innocent woman on a search for her knight in shining armour whilst secretly fantasizing how she'd love to own a ruthless beast of a man with no emotions which she honestly thinks shed be able to change.

i mean id love the person who wrote that blog to come here and explain to me which muslim guy seduced this young sikhni to semi nude revealing pics of herself on RD just less than ten minutes ago.
http://www.ratedesi.com/view.php?id=30426

[sikhndconquer]

yeah spot on.
We all know the mind of a woman, sikh or otherwise. potrays herself as an innocent woman on a search for her knight in shining armour whilst secretly fantasizing how she'd love to own a ruthless beast of a man with no emotions which she honestly thinks shed be able to change.

i mean id love the person who wrote that blog to come here and explain to me which muslim guy seduced this young sikhni to semi nude revealing pics of herself on RD just less than ten minutes ago.
http://www.ratedesi.com/view.php?id=30426

fuking skanks!

[PuNjabi_RaNi*]

Stfu.

[RacingSoul]

all guys are horny bastards,now if the gals had any sense they shud know not to shag any dude,1st they shud say,marry me if u love me then sexy time,rather than be sweet talked into bed!!!!!!


condoms...ever heard of them?

oh my bad, ur from Englund :)

[JattVirginiaDa]

I find this thread very interesting :). I will post some good lines soon.

[PuNjabi_RaNi*]

condoms...ever heard of them?

oh my bad, ur from Englund :)
Get outta the UK forum then! :slap:

[PRCIV]

It's simple. Hindu and Sikh community is far more liberal in every way. They allow their daughters to socialize freely with people of different faiths instead of keeping them chained in the bedroom. I blame the parents as much anyone else.

And to be fair, trying to portray Pakis as the sole culprits is counterproductive, why are these filthy whores so easily willing to give up their faith and heritage ? It's not like they're being raped, they're willingly eloping with the Muslim guys. The key here is to become more conservative and hardline when it comes to certain communities. I'd go into it further but then I'd end up getting banned like the threadmaker.

[Punjabi_Link]

But aren't all desi girls in UK the same?

I know couple of my sikh punjabi friends in UK are dating pakistani women. I wonder if they're just using them for sex. :neutral:

[Punjabi_Link]

It's simple. Hindu and Sikh community is far more liberal in every way. They allow their daughters to socialize freely with people of different faiths instead of keeping them chained in the bedroom. I blame the parents as much anyone else.

And to be fair, trying to portray Pakis as the sole culprits is counterproductive, why are these filthy whores so easily willing to give up their faith and heritage ? It's not like they're being raped, they're willingly eloping with the Muslim guys. The key here is to become more conservative and hardline when it comes to certain communities. I'd go into it further but then I'd end up getting banned like the threadmaker.

I wouldn't go that far, but I agree that parents of these "whores" need to be little more strict to them.

[nabx]

To be honest it was the sikh community that I respected the most till yet in india

You have left out many variables to the argument

So your argument is incomplete and it is showing only one side of the coin

And I find it unfair that you have stated it like that

You really need to sit down and talk to people

[PuNjabi_RaNi*]

But aren't all desi girls in UK the same?
I know couple of my sikh punjabi friends in UK are dating pakistani women. I wonder if they're just using them for sex. :neutral:
LOL no they are not & that's a bit far fetched to say dont ya think? :ugh:

You find mixed dating all over the place not just the UK.

[crazy_meera1]

Every year 100,000 Hindu & Sikh girls are eloping with muslims by way of rape & blackmail.
Reader comment on article: The Travails of Brooklyn's Arabic Academy
in response to reader comment: not new

Submitted by Nisha (India), May 29, 2007 at 09:57

I agree with you . As an Indian living in capital Delhi , I know many cases where Muslims posing as Hindu boys meet and date educated Hindu / Sikh girls , they are show their love and care , As soon as the girl agrees to go to date with a muslim boy , he give them drugs ( sleeping pills) in tea / coffee and gang rape them as soon as they are unconscious. They take their nude photos and video movies. They show them when they are conscious and blackmail them to be exploited physically and financially. They even order them to bring few of their friends ( girls) along with them next time. They repeat the same thing with their friends as well. The racket grows.

There have been so many cases. Unlike West , The girls will not open her mouth and tell to her family because of the fear of family elders. Even if some girl will tell her family members , they will try to keep her silent becasue this exposure can do damage to family prestige and honour. In the end the girl is badly exploited . Either she is converted to Islam and made muslim. Or she is sold to the prostitute pimps ( who are muslims majority) for prostitution . The money they get is used to lure and trap new girls to repeat the same menace. In public the girl is forced to give statements in favour of Islam and she is even forced to confess that she loves so and so muslim boy and she willingly went with him because muslim boys and his friends threaten her to do so and they also do Islamic Ritual Slaughter ( Halal) of animals in front of her and threaten her that If she dare to open her mouth in front of police , media or anyone else , They will make sure that she and her family members are also murdered in the same cruel way.............

This is the real story of thousands of Indian ( Non Muslim ) girls. I know this because two of my friends suffered this hell . One of them was forced to convert to Islam and produce dozen kids and pray five times to allah . Second friend committed suicide. I wrote to many influential people and media but they are afraid to take up the issue as muslims are involved in this episode and taking this issue can prompt any Mulla to give a call of Jehad to his Friday worshippers and his office can be ransacked and he can be murdered in broad daylight. and Politicians don't wont to speak any word because they are afraid of loosing muslim votes because 200 million muslims in India are almost 20 % and they vote en masse and this matters a lot in Democracy like India.............

This could be happen to any girl now ...........and its growing in almost every city.

source: http://www.danielpipes.org/comments/95111








lol...okay,,i onli read the first line and it made me laff,,neways u said the sikh girls are ELOPING with the muslim guys by rape?!

loll...eloping...yall are funny..

[warrior84]

yeh i knew a Sikh jattni in college. she didnt have any female friends and mostly hung around with muslim males. it was common knowledge that she converted to islam.

i asked her about this and she told me that she is pretending to be a muslim convert. because of pressure from the people she would hang around.
i still thought it was strange to even pretend to convert to a religion. eventually she did convert and came into college wearing a head scarve a month later.

[punjabimunda3000]

its not because sikh parants our easy on their kids, its because sikh parants don't teach their kids about sikhism and sikh history, and i bet 90% of these girls didn't have a good relationship with their parants, think about it you spend your whole life with your parants who raise you it shouldn't be that easy for the girls to turn their back on their parants and never see them again for the rest of their lives.

Also some dumb punjabis play the double standards were they celeberate when a boy is born and cry when a girl is so they end up neglecting the girl her whole life. So if she wants to run away from home with her bf its pretty easy decision and if she isn't close with her parants and family then its easy for the girl to run away with her bf and not see her parants again.


Girls who bin tought something about sikhism and know sikh history and have good close relationship with their family's could never hurt their family's.

Girls who have no idea about sikhism and sikh history and dont have a close relationship with their parants are likely to sleep around go to clubs and get drunk wearing mini skirts jumping on guys.

ive seen sikh girls who could never think about doing anything that would hurt their family's because they have open communication with their family and are extremely close to their family and have had their parants take the time to teach them the basics of sikhi and sikh history and teach them good morals and self resepct and the parants trust them rather then make them feel like prisioners.

[crazy_meera1]

its not because sikh parants our easy on their kids, its because sikh parants don't teach their kids about sikhism and sikh history, and i bet 90% of these girls didn't have a good relationship with their parants, think about it you spend your whole life with your parants who raise you it shouldn't be that easy for the girls to turn their back on their parants and never see them again for the rest of their lives.

Also some dumb punjabis play the double standards were they celeberate when a boy is born and cry when a girl is so they end up neglecting the girl her whole life so if she wants to run away from home with her bf its pretty easy decision and i doubt they would have any regret.


Girls who bin tought something about sikhism and know sikh history and have good close relationship with their family's could never hurt their family's.

Girls who have no idea about sikhism and sikh history and dont have a close relationship with their parants are likely to sleep around go to clubs and get drunk wearing mini skirts jumping on guys.

ive seen sikh girls who could never think about doing anything that would hurt their family's because they have open communication with their family and and are extremely close to their family and have had their parants take the time to teach them the basics of sikhi and sikh history and teach them good morals and self resepct and the parants trust them.


i so agree with you! but theres also this thing called self respect...

[Punjabi_Link]

LOL no they are not & that's a bit far fetched to say dont ya think? :ugh:

You find mixed dating all over the place not just the UK.

Yeah, I guess you’re right, but reading these stories and articles like the one OP posted here and seeing how a lot of people react to this issue seems like it is a major problem in UK and its give a negative image to us outsiders how desi girls in the UK behave like. But of course, there are some decent UK desi girls out there I have met in the past, so I can’t really say all desi girls in UK are the same. lol

[Rogue]

It's simple. Hindu and Sikh community is far more liberal in every way. They allow their daughters to socialize freely with people of different faiths instead of keeping them chained in the bedroom. I blame the parents as much anyone else.

And to be fair, trying to portray Pakis as the sole culprits is counterproductive, why are these filthy whores so easily willing to give up their faith and heritage ? It's not like they're being raped, they're willingly eloping with the Muslim guys. The key here is to become more conservative and hardline when it comes to certain communities. I'd go into it further but then I'd end up getting banned like the threadmaker.
:werd:

lol, it's "free will" only until the point you make a booboo and aren't strong enough to confront your own mistakes, inability to make sound decisions, and other shortcomings.

at this point, blaming literally anything/everything around you comes in quite handy.

[krazie k]

i read one the posts where someone had said that sikh girls have a liberated way of life and have more freedom than pakistani girls which is why they "put out" this is not true sikh familes are strict just as muslim familes, i dont see any difference in the two cultures or way of upbringing.

i know of sikh girls that in even nowadays cannot go swimming while guys are there, cannot even go out in the evenings, and cannot date. so the upbrining has no relevence.

im am sikh girl myself, but i dont think we should blame just the guys, the girls are to blame here aswell, nobody will force them to sleep with a muslim guy they do that of their own free will, and as for conversion that aswell is of their own free will

[crazy_meera1]

i read one the posts where someone had said that sikh girls have a liberated way of life and have more freedom than pakistani girls which is why they "put out" this is not true sikh familes are strict just as muslim familes, i dont see any difference in the two cultures or way of upbringing.

i know of sikh girls that in even nowadays cannot go swimming while guys are there, cannot even go out in the evenings, and cannot date. so the upbrining has no relevence.

im am sikh girl myself, but i dont think we should blame just the guys, the girls are to blame here aswell, nobody will force them to sleep with a muslim guy they do that of their own free will, and as for conversion that aswell is of their own free will


omg u are soooooo freakin rite!! i lov u for saying thissssssssss!!!!!!! thank godd someones normal around here! :shock: i know this coz i hang wit some indians, and their families are no diff then mines.

[punjabimunda3000]

its not because sikh parants our easy on their kids, its because sikh parants don't teach their kids about sikhism and sikh history, and i bet 90% of these girls didn't have a good relationship with their parants, think about it you spend your whole life with your parants who raise you it shouldn't be that easy for the girls to turn their back on their parants and never see them again for the rest of their lives.

Also some dumb punjabis play the double standards were they celeberate when a boy is born and cry when a girl is so they end up neglecting the girl her whole life. So if she wants to run away from home with her bf its pretty easy decision and if she isn't close with her parants and family then its easy for the girl to run away with her bf and not see her parants again.


Girls who bin tought something about sikhism and know sikh history and have good close relationship with their family's could never hurt their family's.

Girls who have no idea about sikhism and sikh history and dont have a close relationship with their parants are likely to sleep around go to clubs and get drunk wearing mini skirts jumping on guys.

ive seen sikh girls who could never think about doing anything that would hurt their family's because they have open communication with their family and are extremely close to their family and have had their parants take the time to teach them the basics of sikhi and sikh history and teach them good morals and self resepct and the parants trust them rather then make them feel like prisioners.

[di vinci]

its not because sikh parants our easy on their kids, its because sikh parants don't teach their kids about sikhism and sikh history, and i bet 90% of these girls didn't have a good relationship with their parants, think about it you spend your whole life with your parants who raise you it shouldn't be that easy for the girls to turn their back on their parants and never see them again for the rest of their lives.

Also some dumb punjabis play the double standards were they celeberate when a boy is born and cry when a girl is so they end up neglecting the girl her whole life. So if she wants to run away from home with her bf its pretty easy decision and if she isn't close with her parants and family then its easy for the girl to run away with her bf and not see her parants again.


Girls who bin tought something about sikhism and know sikh history and have good close relationship with their family's could never hurt their family's.

Girls who have no idea about sikhism and sikh history and dont have a close relationship with their parants are likely to sleep around go to clubs and get drunk wearing mini skirts jumping on guys.

ive seen sikh girls who could never think about doing anything that would hurt their family's because they have open communication with their family and are extremely close to their family and have had their parants take the time to teach them the basics of sikhi and sikh history and teach them good morals and self resepct and the parants trust them rather then make them feel like prisioners.
totally agree these days kids havve no morals, they have no belonging and no identity.

[krazie k]

its not because sikh parants our easy on their kids, its because sikh parants don't teach their kids about sikhism and sikh history, and i bet 90% of these girls didn't have a good relationship with their parants, think about it you spend your whole life with your parants who raise you it shouldn't be that easy for the girls to turn their back on their parants and never see them again for the rest of their lives.

Also some dumb punjabis play the double standards were they celeberate when a boy is born and cry when a girl is so they end up neglecting the girl her whole life. So if she wants to run away from home with her bf its pretty easy decision and if she isn't close with her parants and family then its easy for the girl to run away with her bf and not see her parants again.


Girls who bin tought something about sikhism and know sikh history and have good close relationship with their family's could never hurt their family's.

Girls who have no idea about sikhism and sikh history and dont have a close relationship with their parants are likely to sleep around go to clubs and get drunk wearing mini skirts jumping on guys.

ive seen sikh girls who could never think about doing anything that would hurt their family's because they have open communication with their family and are extremely close to their family and have had their parants take the time to teach them the basics of sikhi and sikh history and teach them good morals and self resepct and the parants trust them rather then make them feel like prisioners.

im sorry but i dont know where you get your stuff from like i said before, im sikh my parents taught me everything about sikhi, i went guradwara every sunday celebrate every festival know everything there is to know about my religion, my family are still to this day strict with the girls in our family

you cant say just because a girl does not know about her religion for that pure simple fact she doesnt have a good relationship with her family thats just bullocks (excuse my language) there are lots of reasons why children dont have good relationships with their parents you cannot pin point it on just religion

then you say the "dumb punjabi's" play the double standard when they have a girl dat does not just happen in sikhi that happens everywhere

let me give you an example i know of a sikh girl who has a muslim bf has been with him 9 years they have a son live together she has not converted and neither has he asked her to, they both respect each others religion.

i just wanna know what exactly it is you are having a hard time dealing with sikh girls going out with muslims or sikh girls converting

and maybe you should move it away from the typical sikh girls and start looking at the sikh boys because they aint no better why does it always have to be about girls? sikh boys go out and do exactly the same thing but i suppose thats oki yeah? because their guys, they can get away with anything?

[DasJa]

UK desi's are ALL :nuts:

[crazy_meera1]

UK desi's are ALL :nuts:


dudeeeeeeeee i agree with you too



lolllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllllll..dam n....

[selina_786]

wtbollocks, why would a sikh girl go for a mullah supporting a beard and hat int he first place? I don't know what world you are living in but I certainly havent seen sikh girls with 'conversative' muslims before.
Although the other criteria does make sense but why are you sounding so defenseless, oh yea.. its sikh girls putting out.

A few people have mentioned that sikh girls put out because they don't have the right upbringing and their parents give their alot of freedom. That's bollocks, sikhs as a majority are just like pakistani Muslims, the girls have a similiar lifestyle. In common terms, no they arent allowed out after a certain time, they can't hang out with boys, they have to dress modestly and dating is a no no. So in that sense perhaps it is true but not really with the message you are trying to put accross, sikhs do try and teach religion to their children. where freedom comes into this, I don't understand. So

I don't really understand why the majority of sikh girls have a thing for muslim blokes, perhaps just like blacks, pakis etc etc, punjabi sikhs girls and blokes prefer not to date their own kind? Possible? I think so.
Perhaps sikh girls don't wanna go for turbanators, just like Muslim girls prefer not to go for mullahs.

With paki blokes, these girls can relate to them culture wise yet having to leave their own problems/issues arising within the family on a side. Perhaps theirs no guilt involved in dating a non sikh?

The fundamentalist pakis. lololol.. what a big joke.

Also, sikh girls go for paki boys because of jihad and shit? Where the hell did all of this crap come from? :lol: Nice excuse. Sikh girls have been dating paki muslims for centuries now.. way before this hardcore terrorist shit started getting overhyped.

I'm gonna put the blame on the girls for being so damn stupid in the first place. Don't open your legs, don't 'supposedly' fall in love with every man and you won't need to convert, beetches.

Blokes are idiots anyway. Who cares about the race/religion.

Girls, please wisen up. Your men are starting to whinge cuz of your whorish hobbies.

I'd like to say that you get dumbass girls in every race/religion and not just in sikhism.

[selina_786]

btw paki muslim guy (liberal ones) dont give a crap about religion, they just go for whats easy and available.


And if youre saying you feel targeted, then there must be a problem with your girls?

[crazy_meera1]

oh man why cant we just all get along...


man this sucks...rd has become something way more than just the fobs attack............................................ ...................

[selina_786]

oh man why cant we just all get along...


man this sucks...rd has become something way more than just the fobs attack............................................ ...................
no, its alright... we are just discussing

[crazy_meera1]

no, its alright... we are just discussing



thats cool and all, but doesnt everyone just wanna take a break from this?


:cool:

[punjabimunda3000]

im sorry but i dont know where you get your stuff from like i said before, im sikh my parents taught me everything about sikhi, i went guradwara every sunday celebrate every festival know everything there is to know about my religion, my family are still to this day strict with the girls in our family

you cant say just because a girl does not know about her religion for that pure simple fact she doesnt have a good relationship with her family thats just bullocks (excuse my language) there are lots of reasons why children dont have good relationships with their parents you cannot pin point it on just religion

then you say the "dumb punjabi's" play the double standard when they have a girl dat does not just happen in sikhi that happens everywhere

let me give you an example i know of a sikh girl who has a muslim bf has been with him 9 years they have a son live together she has not converted and neither has he asked her to, they both respect each others religion.

i just wanna know what exactly it is you are having a hard time dealing with sikh girls going out with muslims or sikh girls converting

and maybe you should move it away from the typical sikh girls and start looking at the sikh boys because they aint no better why does it always have to be about girls? sikh boys go out and do exactly the same thing but i suppose thats oki yeah? because their guys, they can get away with anything?

You did not understand anything i said in my post, i have no idea what your talking about. Your just confused and lost.

[Desi MC]

:rofl: some funny shitDid you read it all ?

[selina_786]

It's simple. Hindu and Sikh community is far more liberal in every way. They allow their daughters to socialize freely with people of different faiths instead of keeping them chained in the bedroom. I blame the parents as much anyone else.

And to be fair, trying to portray Pakis as the sole culprits is counterproductive, why are these filthy whores so easily willing to give up their faith and heritage ? It's not like they're being raped, they're willingly eloping with the Muslim guys. The key here is to become more conservative and hardline when it comes to certain communities. I'd go into it further but then I'd end up getting banned like the threadmaker.
not sikhs

[selina_786]

But aren't all desi girls in UK the same?

I know couple of my sikh punjabi friends in UK are dating pakistani women. I wonder if they're just using them for sex. :neutral:
true.

Lots of pakistani women like sikh punjabi/ black men.

Not hindues much tho... sorry.

[krazie k]

You did not understand anything i said in my post, i have no idea what your talking about. Your just confused and lost.

wtf im lost and confused i seriously think you need to get your facts right instead of wrighting a load of fuckin bullocks

just one thing i want to know, so you think its wrong for sikh girls to convert but i take you would be oki with a sikh man bringing home a girl from a different religion and her converting to sikhism?

you have a really backwards mentailty

[PRCIV]

not sikhs

Sikhs are more liberal than Muslims for sure. You said that the "majority" of Sikh girls go for Muslim guys, that's a huge exaggeration, it's a small percentage in the UK ONLY.

[PRCIV]

true.

Lots of pakistani women like sikh punjabi/ black men.

Not hindues much tho... sorry.

It's ok, we'll survive ;)

[selina_786]

Sikhs are more liberal than Muslims for sure. You said that the "majority" of Sikh girls go for Muslim guys, that's a huge exaggeration, it's a small percentage in the UK ONLY.
sikhs are on similiar levels to muslims...they are not more liberal... sure, minority of sikh families perhaps are alot more liberal than your typical hardcore strict muslim families.

Krazie K can confirm this.

lol, I'm from the uk.... I was talking about dating and not converting. It is the majority of sikh girls that go for paki muslims. I don't think they actually take into consideration a persons relgiion when dating...

Are you british?

[PRCIV]

wtf im lost and confused i seriously think you need to get your facts right instead of wrighting a load of fuckin bullocks

just one thing i want to know, so you think its wrong for sikh girls to convert but i take you would be oki with a sikh man bringing home a girl from a different religion and her converting to sikhism?

you have a really backwards mentailty

Lol of course. When you convert someone from a different religion, you're adding one to your team. Besides, this is how ALL men think.

[selina_786]

It's ok, we'll survive ;)
I think it applies with alot of sikh girls too.

[di vinci]

Did you read it all ?nope you?

[sikhndconquer]

wtbollocks, why would a sikh girl go for a mullah supporting a beard and hat int he first place? I don't know what world you are living in but I certainly havent seen sikh girls with 'conversative' muslims before.
Although the other criteria does make sense but why are you sounding so defenseless, oh yea.. its sikh girls putting out.

A few people have mentioned that sikh girls put out because they don't have the right upbringing and their parents give their alot of freedom. That's bollocks, sikhs as a majority are just like pakistani Muslims, the girls have a similiar lifestyle. In common terms, no they arent allowed out after a certain time, they can't hang out with boys, they have to dress modestly and dating is a no no. So in that sense perhaps it is true but not really with the message you are trying to put accross, sikhs do try and teach religion to their children. where freedom comes into this, I don't understand. So

I don't really understand why the majority of sikh girls have a thing for muslim blokes, perhaps just like blacks, pakis etc etc, punjabi sikhs girls and blokes prefer not to date their own kind? Possible? I think so.
Perhaps sikh girls don't wanna go for turbanators, just like Muslim girls prefer not to go for mullahs.

With paki blokes, these girls can relate to them culture wise yet having to leave their own problems/issues arising within the family on a side. Perhaps theirs no guilt involved in dating a non sikh?

The fundamentalist pakis. lololol.. what a big joke.

Also, sikh girls go for paki boys because of jihad and shit? Where the hell did all of this crap come from? :lol: Nice excuse. Sikh girls have been dating paki muslims for centuries now.. way before this hardcore terrorist shit started getting overhyped.

I'm gonna put the blame on the girls for being so damn stupid in the first place. Don't open your legs, don't 'supposedly' fall in love with every man and you won't need to convert, beetches.

Blokes are idiots anyway. Who cares about the race/religion.

Girls, please wisen up. Your men are starting to whinge cuz of your whorish hobbies.

I'd like to say that you get dumbass girls in every race/religion and not just in sikhism.


i think most sikhs that do complain about this phenomina are the sikhs that in the rehat(true sikhs) for the ones that have hair cuts this not a matter. like you mentioned not alot of girls like that turban image or whateva..personal preference.

[PRCIV]

sikhs are on similiar levels to muslims...they are not more liberal... sure, minority of sikh families perhaps are alot more liberal than your typical hardcore strict muslim families.

Krazie K can confirm this.

lol, I'm from the uk.... I was talking about dating and not converting. It is the majority of sikh girls that go for paki muslims. I don't think they actually take into consideration a persons relgiion when dating...

Are you british?

I'm not British but if you say that the majority of Sikh girls in the UK date Paki men then I'll take your word for it.

[PuNjabi_RaNi*]

Sikhs are more liberal than Muslims for sure. You said that the "majority" of Sikh girls go for Muslim guys, that's a huge exaggeration, it's a small percentage in the UK ONLY.
Wtf are you on? Both sikhs and muslims are on the same level.

Are you getting religion mixed up with culture.

[selina_786]

i think most sikhs that do complain about this phenomina are the sikhs that in the rehat(true sikhs) for the ones that have hair cuts this not a matter. like you mentioned not alot of girls like that turban image or whateva..personal preference.
yea makes sense why they would complain.. I think these girls are taught enough about their religion but they willingly go with other blokes because its a cool thing to do.

[PRCIV]

I think it applies with alot of sikh girls too.

I know it does. I'm not disputing it either.

[selina_786]

I'm not British but if you say that the majority of Sikh girls in the UK date Paki men then I'll take your word for it.
I think you lot are a little too hooked up on religion here.

Apart from hindus.. mullahs and turbanators.. its pretty difficult to tell the rest apart... sikhs and muslims date commonly. It's this converting thing thats becoming an issue now.

[PRCIV]

Wtf are you on? Both sikhs and muslims are on the same level.

Are you getting religion mixed up with culture.

Sikhs are as conservative as Muslims ?? That's news to me.

[PuNjabi_RaNi*]

Sikhs are as conservative as Muslims ?? That's news to me.

Really? you must live in a small world.

[PRCIV]

I think you lot are a little too hooked up on religion here.

Apart from hindus.. mullahs and turbanators.. its pretty difficult to tell the rest apart... sikhs and muslims date commonly. It's this converting thing thats becoming an issue now.

Hmmm lol ok. I'm curious, What sets Hindus apart ?

[Punjabi_Link]

true.

Lots of pakistani women like sikh punjabi/ black men.

Not hindues much tho... sorry.

Yeah, I have notice that here in Canada.

[selina_786]

Wtf are you on? Both sikhs and muslims are on the same level.

Are you getting religion mixed up with culture.
Yes, finally someone agrees. The cultures are extremely similiar.


And I think I mentioned, its pretty common for muslim girls date sikh boys as well. I know fo loads but heres the difference... muslim girls are a little clever here and keep their shit low key to save them from humiliation later... punjabi girls dont care and tend to brag about it. (Im stereotyping)

Apart from that, no difference when it comes to hoeing.

[PRCIV]

Really? you must live in a small world.

Well I don't live in the UK and most of the Sikhs I've known have been liberal, how that qualifies as a small world I don't know.

[selina_786]

Hmmm lol ok. I'm curious, What sets Hindus apart ?
Not in a bad way or anything.. You lot are way too liberal.. I guess you see that as a good thing. I'm just an observer.

[PuNjabi_RaNi*]

Also one thing i wanna point out is that hindu girls stay in the background - but im alot of them have gone into mixed dating

Sikhi & Islam have had alot of history together - hence why today they are the most talked about religions.

[warrior84]

who cares how people percieve Sikh women. and who cares if these girls are converting? i couldnt care less.

its nothing to do with me what someone does with their life.

[selina_786]

Well I don't live in the UK and most of the Sikhs I've known have been liberal, how that qualifies as a small world I don't know.
America? Plenty of liberal muslims there as well

[Punjabi_Link]

Sikhs are as conservative as Muslims ?? That's news to me.

Outside of USA, Sikhs tend to be conservative.

[Punjabi_Link]

who cares how people percieve Sikh women. and who cares if these girls are converting? i couldnt care less.

its nothing to do with me what someone does with their life.

then don't post here. lol

[PuNjabi_RaNi*]

Well I don't live in the UK and most of the Sikhs I've known have been liberal, how that qualifies as a small world I don't know.
USA? Well mate i have heard about how liberal folks are there - whether you be a sikh, hindi or muslim.

In UK it's a different story.

[selina_786]

Also one thing i wanna point out is that hindu girls stay in the background - but im alot of them have gone into mixed dating

Sikhi & Islam have had alot of history together - hence why today they are the most talked about religions.yea but its not an issue to hindu families.

It's an issue in sikhi/muslim families which is why its talked about so much and then all sorts of fabricated rumours and stuff sprout from it all.

[PuNjabi_RaNi*]

wtf im lost and confused i seriously think you need to get your facts right instead of wrighting a load of fuckin bullocks

just one thing i want to know, so you think its wrong for sikh girls to convert but i take you would be oki with a sikh man bringing home a girl from a different religion and her converting to sikhism?

you have a really backwards mentailty

Yeah, it's so double standard man.

Blokes think they have the upper hand but its complete bs.

[warrior84]

then don't post here. lol

well if parents couldnt care what thier daughters are doing then why should i care about these girls.
ive got my own problems. lol

[PuNjabi_RaNi*]

yea but its not an issue to hindu families.

It's an issue in sikhi/muslim families which is why its talked about so much and then all sorts of fabricated rumours and stuff sprout from it all.
Yeah exactly but I find the sikh & muslims similiar in thinking terms - least the people i come across myself.

[Punjabi_Link]

well if parents couldnt care what thier daughters are doing then why should i care about these girls.
ive got my own problems. lol

true say. lol

[PRCIV]

Not in a bad way or anything.. You lot are way too liberal.. I guess you see that as a good thing. I'm just an observer.

Yup Hindus are way too liberal. I'm not one of them so count me out.

[krazie k]

Yeah, it's so double standard man.

Blokes think they have the upper hand but its complete bs.

yeah i totally agree men just go out be man whores and get away with it while us women have to get all the stick

[selina_786]

Yup Hindus are way too liberal. I'm not one of them so count me out.
no worries mate, u dont fit the stereotype

[krazie k]

Yup Hindus are way too liberal. I'm not one of them so count me out.

your right hindus are too liberal i overheard a conversationg once this hindu girl telling her mum she was bringing her white bf home for dinner i was like wtf

if id have said dat to my mum i would have got battered by a belna lol

[selina_786]

yeah i totally agree men just go out be man whores and get away with it while us women have to get all the stick
bastards

[DasJa]

yea but its not an issue to hindu families.

It's an issue in sikhi/muslim families which is why its talked about so much and then all sorts of fabricated rumours and stuff sprout from it all.
Or maybe it's the whole British Sikh-Muslim culture which has evolved to a point where a confused identity is the only identity.

I mean, on one end, Sikhs talk about the courage of the 10 guru's, the upholding of Sikhi..and with the other hand, they chug glassy after glassy, have all the freedom in the world, keep the women pretty much in the background, and differentiate (although that is mainly a Jatt issue) on caste.

The Muslims have that whole "Salaam-brother" mentality, which is just plain weird. Goin around with in their dad's audi's, acting pimp n shit, while trying to show they're proper gentlemen by respecting their religion (as if :rolleyes: ).




Both the communities have so much confusion, and the society and cultural pressure to follow religion and the desi norm just adds to confused sikh girls being led astray by any playa half worth his weight in salt. Hindu's too, but since THAT religion relies more on non-violence rather than a violent method to rid of evil...Hindu girls and guys tend to stay in the background between this whole racial religious tension. They go more for the $$$.

[PRCIV]

your right hindus are too liberal i overheard a conversationg once this hindu girl telling her mum she was bringing her white bf home for dinner i was like wtf

if id have said dat to my mum i would have got battered by a belna lol

Hindus don't have as strong a sense of identity, and if they do, then they more so identify with their caste rather than religion per se.

[punjabimunda3000]

wtf im lost and confused i seriously think you need to get your facts right instead of wrighting a load of fuckin bullocks

just one thing i want to know, so you think its wrong for sikh girls to convert but i take you would be oki with a sikh man bringing home a girl from a different religion and her converting to sikhism?

you have a really backwards mentailty


what the hell are you smoking. Your seriously confused. Were the hell did i talk about it being wrong for sikh girls to convert, were the hell did i talk about it being ok for a sikh guy bringing a girl from another religion home is ok.

Basicully my message was this, girls that have low morals that ive seen, tend to not share a close relationships with their familys and this may have to do with boys being favoured over girls, as well they have no idea or clue about sikhi or sikh history, but their also girls that i have seen who have a close relationship with their family, their parants have educated them about sikhi, they have open communication with their parants were they can talk about anything, their parants have taken the time to teach them morals, and their parants trust them rather then make them feel like prisioners and these girls would never do anything and would never even think about anything that could hurt their parants. Cause they have high morals and they don't want to destroy that trust their parants have and their way to close with their parants to see them hurt.

[DasJa]

your right hindus are too liberal i overheard a conversationg once this hindu girl telling her mum she was bringing her white bf home for dinner i was like wtf

if id have said dat to my mum i would have got battered by a belna lol
There's nothin wrong with that.


If I had a white gf whom I loved, I don't see what's wrong. Similarly, if my sister had a white bf or a paki bf, I'd definitely check up on his background to see if he's a college educated proper gentlemen..or onna those dime-a-dozen thug wannabe's. And if he's sincere, i'd definetely support my sister.


fo fuck's sake, you take a paki's DNA and you take a an Indian DNA and IT IS 100% same!! There's absolutely NO difference in what we eat, how we look or how we talk. It's only the general asinine desi thinking which confuses da heck outta me, and i'm a stable 24 year old guy...so I can just imagine the confusion goin through a 16 year old girl...specially being brought up in a place like UK :no:

[selina_786]

Or maybe it's the whole British Sikh-Muslim culture which has evolved to a point where a confused identity is the only identity.

I mean, on one end, Sikhs talk about the courage of the 10 guru's, the upholding of Sikhi..and with the other hand, they chug glassy after glassy, have all the freedom in the world, keep the women pretty much in the background, and differentiate (although that is mainly a Jatt issue) on caste.

The Muslims have that whole "Salaam-brother" mentality, which is just plain weird. Goin around with in their dad's audi's, acting pimp n shit, while trying to show they're proper gentlemen by respecting their religion (as if :rolleyes: ).




Both the communities have so much confusion, and the society and cultural pressure to follow religion and the desi norm just adds to confused sikh girls being led astray by any playa half worth his weight in salt. Hindu's too, but since THAT religion relies more on non-violence rather than a violent method to rid of evil...Hindu girls and guys tend to stay in the background between this whole racial religious tension. They go more for the $$$.
Yea actually you have some good points and I can see why they all date each other now if we look at it from your perspective.
In the end, its the women that suffer .. sikh and Muslim.. probably the reason why you say they are easily led astray..

Guys are we reading and understanding? Perhaps we should consider giving a little freedom tot he women too and perhaps they would learn to use their brains a little and make sound desicions?

[krazie k]

what the hell are you smoking. Your seriously confused. Were the hell did i talk about it being wrong for sikh girls to convert, were the hell did i talk about it being ok for a sikh guy bringing a girl from another religion home is ok.


excuse me i didnt say you said that i asked you a question, so chill before you bust a blood vessel!!

[PRCIV]

Or maybe it's the whole British Sikh-Muslim culture which has evolved to a point where a confused identity is the only identity.

I mean, on one end, Sikhs talk about the courage of the 10 guru's, the upholding of Sikhi..and with the other hand, they chug glassy after glassy, have all the freedom in the world, keep the women pretty much in the background, and differentiate (although that is mainly a Jatt issue) on caste.

The Muslims have that whole "Salaam-brother" mentality, which is just plain weird. Goin around with in their dad's audi's, acting pimp n shit, while trying to show they're proper gentlemen by respecting their religion (as if :rolleyes: ).




Both the communities have so much confusion, and the society and cultural pressure to follow religion and the desi norm just adds to confused sikh girls being led astray by any playa half worth his weight in salt. Hindu's too, but since THAT religion relies more on non-violence rather than a violent method to rid of evil...Hindu girls and guys tend to stay in the background between this whole racial religious tension. They go more for the $$$.

That's right *****. Show me the money ! :cool:

[PRCIV]

There's nothin wrong with that.


If I had a white gf whom I loved, I don't see what's wrong. Similarly, if my sister had a white bf or a paki bf, I'd definitely check up on his background to see if he's a college educated proper gentlemen..or onna those dime-a-dozen thug wannabe's. And if he's sincere, i'd definetely support my sister.


fo fuck's sake, you take a paki's DNA and you take a an Indian DNA and IT IS 100% same!! There's absolutely NO difference in what we eat, how we look or how we talk. It's only the general asinine desi thinking which confuses da heck outta me, and i'm a stable 24 year old guy...so I can just imagine the confusion goin through a 16 year old girl...specially being brought up in a place like UK :no:

That's not true. Pakis are blonde, blue-eyed Aryans.

[PRCIV]

Yea actually you have some good points and I can see why they all date each other now if we look at it from your perspective.
In the end, its the women that suffer .. sikh and Muslim.. probably the reason why you say they are easily led astray..

Guys are we reading and understanding? Perhaps we should consider giving a little freedom tot he women too and perhaps they would learn to use their brains a little and make sound desicions?

How about no. Because www.menarebetterthanwomen.com

[Kasheer]

That's not true. Pakis are blonde, blue-eyed Aryans.

LOL u takin the piss?

[DasJa]

That's right *****. Show me the money ! :cool:
That's not true. Pakis are blonde, blue-eyed Aryans.

Here ya go...represent yo self foo

http://www.anti-caste.org/muslim_question/kar_sevak.jpg

[Punjabi_Link]

That's not true. Pakis are blonde, blue-eyed Aryans.

o rly? I thought they were Arabs descent. :rolleyes:

EDIT: This thread is turning into a man bashing thread. :ugh:

[PuNjabi_RaNi*]

yeah i totally agree men just go out be man whores and get away with it while us women have to get all the stick

They are the worst - then they have the balls to preach on how women are sluts & whores if they date outta their own community.

Today women are making their own choices but it doesnt seem to click with society - hence why bogus forced dating & conversion stories are made.

[selina_786]

There's nothin wrong with that.


If I had a white gf whom I loved, I don't see what's wrong. Similarly, if my sister had a white bf or a paki bf, I'd definitely check up on his background to see if he's a college educated proper gentlemen..or onna those dime-a-dozen thug wannabe's. And if he's sincere, i'd definetely support my sister.


fo fuck's sake, you take a paki's DNA and you take a an Indian DNA and IT IS 100% same!! There's absolutely NO difference in what we eat, how we look or how we talk. It's only the general asinine desi thinking which confuses da heck outta me, and i'm a stable 24 year old guy...so I can just imagine the confusion goin through a 16 year old girl...specially being brought up in a place like UK :no:
:amen:

[di vinci]

How about no. Because www.menarebetterthanwomen.com (http://www.menarebetterthanwomen.com)
lol

[selina_786]

How about no. Because www.menarebetterthanwomen.com (http://www.menarebetterthanwomen.com)
You are only better with our support. Thats right.

[PRCIV]

:amen:

Don't look now but Pakplaya will soon remind us Hindus that we are subhumans

[krazie k]

They are the worst - then they have the balls to preach on how women are sluts & whores if they date outta their own community.

Today women are making their own choices but it doesnt seem to click with society - hence why bogus forced dating & conversion stories are made.

exactly well said!

[sikhndconquer]

Or maybe it's the whole British Sikh-Muslim culture which has evolved to a point where a confused identity is the only identity.

I mean, on one end, Sikhs talk about the courage of the 10 guru's, the upholding of Sikhi..and with the other hand, they chug glassy after glassy, have all the freedom in the world, keep the women pretty much in the background, and differentiate (although that is mainly a Jatt issue) on caste.

The Muslims have that whole "Salaam-brother" mentality, which is just plain weird. Goin around with in their dad's audi's, acting pimp n shit, while trying to show they're proper gentlemen by respecting their religion (as if :rolleyes: ).




Both the communities have so much confusion, and the society and cultural pressure to follow religion and the desi norm just adds to confused sikh girls being led astray by any playa half worth his weight in salt. Hindu's too, but since THAT religion relies more on non-violence rather than a violent method to rid of evil...Hindu girls and guys tend to stay in the background between this whole racial religious tension. They go more for the $$$.

yeh yeh blame the jatt's..oh so they cant talk about courage of there Guru's because they drink? haha..so you dont have confused identity?

[PuNjabi_RaNi*]

if id have said dat to my mum i would have got battered by a belna lol
:rofl: That rings a bell

[PRCIV]

LOL u takin the piss?

No I was being serious. hold up, let me find some videos featuring blonde pakis

[Kasheer]

No I was being serious. hold up, let me find some videos featuring blonde pakis

Dats a dumb assumption to make, the blue eyed blonde people ion Pakistan and India consists of punjabis, pataans, kashmiris, etc, they are all distinct from each other yet at the same time punjabis and pataans and kashmiris livin in pakistan will classify as pakistani!

Heck i'm kashmiri and i do not have fair features at all so itrs not correct to label all the same!

Pakistani is not an ethnic origin, when will people realise that!

[krazie k]

yeh yeh blame the jatt's..oh so they cant talk about courage of there Guru's because they drink? haha..so you dont have confused identity?

exactly like it could be said for muslims who go out and drink and smoke and then go the mosque

theres good in bad in every religion and culture i think people are quick to forget that

[krazie k]

:rofl: That rings a bell


:rofl: :rofl: i think we all been there at some point lol

[DasJa]

yeh yeh blame the jatt's..oh so they cant talk about courage of there Guru's because they drink? haha..so you dont have confused identity?
You missed the ENTIRE FUCKIN POINT :no:


Anyhoo, I've said it before and i'll say it again....there's really NO POINT in conversing with you. Your views and mine are polar opposites, and I fail to see anything education coming out of a "discussion" with someone of ur....upbringing

[crazy_meera1]

exactly like it could be said for muslims who go out and drink and smoke and then go the mosque

theres good in bad in every religion and culture i think people are quick to forget that



yall havent stopped yet :shock:


someone make a new thread.

[PRCIV]

You missed the ENTIRE FUCKIN POINT :no:


Anyhoo, I've said it before and i'll say it again....there's really NO POINT in conversing with you. Your views and mine are polar opposites, and I fail to see anything education coming out of a "discussion" with someone of ur....upbringing

Your views are too fuckin'....moderate. Always trying to compromise and reason with people.

[Kasheer]

exactly like it could be said for muslims who go out and drink and smoke and then go the mosque

theres good in bad in every religion and culture i think people are quick to forget that

As long as u aint hidin and doin ya dirt, no one can judge, nowt wrong wit people who might drink or smoke but still attend mosque/gurdwara, their not sayin its ok to do so, they jus do it!

Look how many lies, cheating, backbiting we all do day in day out, yet we dont seem to count that as a great sin!

[punjabimunda3000]

im sorry but i dont know where you get your stuff from like i said before, im sikh my parents taught me everything about sikhi, i went guradwara every sunday celebrate every festival know everything there is to know about my religion, my family are still to this day strict with the girls in our family

you cant say just because a girl does not know about her religion for that pure simple fact she doesnt have a good relationship with her family thats just bullocks (excuse my language) there are lots of reasons why children dont have good relationships with their parents you cannot pin point it on just religion

then you say the "dumb punjabi's" play the double standard when they have a girl dat does not just happen in sikhi that happens everywhere

let me give you an example i know of a sikh girl who has a muslim bf has been with him 9 years they have a son live together she has not converted and neither has he asked her to, they both respect each others religion.

i just wanna know what exactly it is you are having a hard time dealing with sikh girls going out with muslims or sikh girls converting

and maybe you should move it away from the typical sikh girls and start looking at the sikh boys because they aint no better why does it always have to be about girls? sikh boys go out and do exactly the same thing but i suppose thats oki yeah? because their guys, they can get away with anything?


Go read my post again cause your way to lost.

Basicully my message was this, girls that have low morals that ive seen, tend to not share a close relationships with their familys and this may have to do with boys being favoured over girls, as well they have no idea or clue about sikhi or sikh history, but their also girls that i have seen who have a close relationship with their family, their parants have educated them about sikhi, they have open communication with their parants were they can talk about anything, their parants have taken the time to teach them morals, and their parants trust them rather then make them feel like prisioners and these girls would never do anything and would never even think about anything that could hurt their parants. Cause they have high morals and they don't want to destroy that trust their parants have and their way to close with their parants to see them hurt.

[warrior84]

i think its the whole opossites attraction thing.
i remember a muslim girl saying that she finds Sikh men irresistible.
and my ex who was muslim couldnt get over the size of my dhanda. when she saw it she couldnt get over how big it was especially the end bit. i told her thats what makes the b1tches scream. ;)

[PRCIV]

Dats a dumb assumption to make, the blue eyed blonde people ion Pakistan and India consists of punjabis, pataans, kashmiris, etc, they are all distinct from each other yet at the same time punjabis and pataans and kashmiris livin in pakistan will classify as pakistani!

Heck i'm kashmiri and i do not have fair features at all so itrs not correct to label all the same!

Pakistani is not an ethnic origin, when will people realise that!

Lol I was taking the piss man, but most Pakis n Indians don't look alike to be honest.

[krazie k]

As long as u aint hidin and doin ya dirt, no one can judge, nowt wrong wit people who might drink or smoke but still attend mosque/gurdwara, their not sayin its ok to do so, they jus do it!

Look how many lies, cheating, backbiting we all do day in day out, yet we dont seem to count that as a great sin!

i completely agree with that

[krazie k]

i think its the whole opossites attraction thing.
i remember a muslim girl saying that she finds Sikh men irresistible.
and my ex who was muslim couldnt get over the size of my dhanda. when she saw it she couldnt get over how big it was especially the end bit. i told her thats what makes the b1tches scream. ;)



:rofl: :rofl:

[crazy_meera1]

Lol I was taking the piss man, but most Pakis n Indians don't look alike to be honest.


i agree, even tho i am mistaken for one or the other all the time i donno why..

[krazie k]

Go read my post again cause your way to lost.

Basicully my message was this, girls that have low morals that ive seen, tend to not share a close relationships with their familys and this may have to do with boys being favoured over girls, as well they have no idea or clue about sikhi or sikh history, but their also girls that i have seen who have a close relationship with their family, their parants have educated them about sikhi, they have open communication with their parants were they can talk about anything, their parants have taken the time to teach them morals, and their parants trust them rather then make them feel like prisioners and these girls would never do anything and would never even think about anything that could hurt their parants. Cause they have high morals and they don't want to destroy that trust their parants have and their way to close with their parants to see them hurt.

im not even gonna bother with someone who is beyond reasining with!!

[Kasheer]

Lol I was taking the piss man, but most Pakis n Indians don't look alike to be honest.

Again ya bein too specific, there are so many different people in India and Pakistan, all depends on to whom u are reffering!

Most Punjabis from both sides look alike, why?
Cuz they are both punjabi!!!!!!

I get mistaken for sikh punjabi all the time, yet i aint !

U cud narrow it down to, most Northern Indians and Pakis do look alike fact!
Just like south indians look similar to each other and sri lankans etc

[PRCIV]

i agree, even tho i am mistaken for one or the other all the time i donno why..

By Whites ? or by Desis ?

[di vinci]

i think its the whole opossites attraction thing.
i remember a muslim girl saying that she finds Sikh men irresistible.
and my ex who was muslim couldnt get over the size of my dhanda. when she saw it she couldnt get over how big it was especially the end bit. i told her thats what makes the b1tches scream. ;)
best post in all of this thread award goes too you

[DasJa]

Your views are too fuckin'....moderate. Always trying to compromise and reason with people.
I believe in building bridges rather than killin women and children, burning trains and butchering innocent civilians. Woe is me :rolleyes:


If you really knew me, you'd know that's the farthest from the truth. My views are very forthright, and my idol is Shaheed Bhagat Singh...for whom the greatest gift he could give is his life for his country. I'm no fuckin green card or american citizen staying here, preachin Sikhism or Hinduism and then dedicating my resources to America. Indian through and through, and believe if all else fails, the might of the sword shall be decisive.

Like Tupac said, Only God Can Judge Me.

[crazy_meera1]

By Whites ? or by Desis ?


anyone.....either desi paki blks whites

:rolleyes:

[PRCIV]

Again ya bein too specific, there are so many different people in India and Pakistan, all depends on to whom u are reffering!

Most Punjabis from both sides look alike, why?
Cuz they are both punjabi!!!!!!

I get mistaken for sikh punjabi all the time, yet i aint !

U cud narrow it down to, most Northern Indians and Pakis do look alike fact!
Just like south indians look similar to each other and sri lankans etc

All Northern Indians don't resemble Pakis, it's probably just the Punjabis who do.

[DasJa]

Again ya bein too specific, there are so many different people in India and Pakistan, all depends on to whom u are reffering!

Most Punjabis from both sides look alike, why?
Cuz they are both punjabi!!!!!!

I get mistaken for sikh punjabi all the time, yet i aint !

U cud narrow it down to, most Northern Indians and Pakis do look alike fact!
Just like south indians look similar to each other and sri lankans etc
:werd:

My paki friend told me that if I went to Lahore, no one could differentiate whether I was Indian or Paki. Only thing they'd be able to tell is my religion because of the kara I wear.

[PRCIV]

anyone.....either desi paki blks whites

:rolleyes:

U clearly look Paki to me

[PRCIV]

:werd:

My paki friend told me that if I went to Lahore, no one could differentiate whether I was Indian or Paki. Only thing they'd be able to tell is my religion because of the kara I wear.

That's cause you're Punjabi

[di vinci]

All Northern Indians don't resemble Pakis, it's probably just the Punjabis who do.
dude u fuckers all look alike apart from the tamils and mallus

[crazy_meera1]

dude u fuckers all look alike apart from the tamils and mallus


LOLLl thats trueeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

[Kasheer]

All Northern Indians don't resemble Pakis, it's probably just the Punjabis who do.

I never said all, yet many do!
Its just simple fact, i dunno why thats so hard to believe u only have to look around!
If there was no pakistan wat would u say, oh the hindus and sikhs and muslims in northern india all look very different!

lol

Ma grandparents would tell it differently and they were around pre partition!

[punjabimunda3000]

excuse me i didnt say you said that i asked you a question, so chill before you bust a blood vessel!!

If a sikh girl chooses to convert its her own free will, i have no right to judge if thats right or wrong its her life and her decision. If a sikh guy wants to marry a girl from another race or religion then its ok long as he's not out preaching that its not ok for sikh girls to marry other races or religion. But if he preaches that sikh girls should only marry sikh guys while he's out marrying a girl from another religion or race then he's just a hypocrite.

[PRCIV]

dude u fuckers all look alike apart from the tamils and mallus

LMAO you're probably right.

[krazie k]

If a sikh girl chooses to convert its her own free will, i have no right to judge if thats right or wrong its her life and her decision. If a sikh guy wants to marry a girl from another race or religion then its ok long as he's not out preaching that its not ok for sikh girls to marry other races or religion. But if he preaches that sikh girls should only marry sikh guys while he's out marrying a girl from another religion or race then he's just a hypocrite.


yeah and fair play i agree with that

[PRCIV]

I believe in building bridges rather than killin women and children, burning trains and butchering innocent civilians. Woe is me :rolleyes:


If you really knew me, you'd know that's the farthest from the truth. My views are very forthright, and my idol is Shaheed Bhagat Singh...for whom the greatest gift he could give is his life for his country. I'm no fuckin green card or american citizen staying here, preachin Sikhism or Hinduism and then dedicating my resources to America. Indian through and through, and believe if all else fails, the might of the sword shall be decisive.

Like Tupac said, Only God Can Judge Me.

I believe in shooting first and asking questions later

[di vinci]

LMAO you're probably right.
canm we all go and make a differant thread. why DESI-MC cant get laid thread

[selina_786]

U clearly look Paki to me
im told i look Indian alot... thats it tho.

[crazy_meera1]

im told i look Indian alot... thats it tho.


me too.

[crazy_meera1]

canm we all go and make a differant thread. why DESI-MC cant get laid thread


i think god heard my prayersz...............





lol

[di vinci]

i think god heard my prayersz...............





lol
oi, hoi heera

shall we start our own rd lub story

[PRCIV]

me too.

You look the desi version of Jessica Simpson.

[crazy_meera1]

You look the desi version of Jessica Simpson.



is dat bad or gewwwwwwd

[crazy_meera1]

oi, hoi heera

shall we start our own rd lub story



chal aajaa ranjaa

lmfao.

[punjabipride04]

Blah, not again.

Seriously it's not he/it/the dog/parents/the goldfish


It's the girls! They have no one to blame but themselves. It's the same for many girls who are out of their parents sight. They let their hair down do things which wouldn't be accepted by their elders & just do their own thing I guess :dunno: Forget trying to say that the parents haven't educated them with Sikhi etc etc. I myself haven't been brought up in a religious environment at all, that doesn't mean it automatically provides me with the leeway to stray away from my religion & turn into some sort of little bombshell. A lot of these mixed relationships etc happen during university, where by most kids are more carefree. ‘When the cats away the mice will play’. There's many people dating different religions at my university, it's only when the chicks are stuck in 'bubble aka love land' that they begin thinking about conversion for 'love' & not religion, in which case is pretty lame.

Due to some of these conversions making it all the way to the press, only then have they been popping up more online/forums etc.

I know a good few paki chicks that have dated sikh guys aswell as other religions & whites. Along with sikh girls who date pakis/whites etc. They are pretty carefree whilst dating, but say they want to ‘experiment’ whilst young I guess. But that goes for many desi chicks. Heck even the guys date around different religions :google: . This is everywhere not just in the UK. But due to a large number of desi’s living within the UK many of whom live in highly dense desi poplulations there’s a higher probability of it occurring. But there’s also quite a few chicks who just stick to dating their own.

its not because sikh parants our easy on their kids, its because sikh parants don't teach their kids about sikhism and sikh history, and i bet 90% of these girls didn't have a good relationship with their parants, think about it you spend your whole life with your parants who raise you it shouldn't be that easy for the girls to turn their back on their parants and never see them again for the rest of their lives.

What you must understand is that many parents are even now oblivious when it comes to seein/believing the negativity within their own children. They easily pick fault out of others but rarely their own, that’s just a typical desi response to such a situation. Also, although it's hard for a desi girl to turn her back on her own family, but it’s not hard to live a double life. When someone gets used to something day in and day out their family becomes a blur, especially when they are so self absorbed into their boyfriends etc. But this happens in relationships full stop, my friends whom have dated etc, change as people whilst in relationships. One chick who used to be quite close to me, started to just dictate information her boyfriend told/advised her with, she's been dating within her own religion/caste etc..but now is definately not the same girl whom I knew 6 years ago unfortunately.

its Girls who bin tought something about sikhism and know sikh history and have good close relationship with their family's could never hurt their family's.

I disagee, I know girls who’ve been brought up beautifully by their parents and are nothing like them, even with all those wise words and constant support & guidance throughout their lives, they have little love for religion & rebel out of choice. Once you loose your child it’s hard to get them back trust wise etc. It can take a whole lifetime to build a solid level of trust with ones child but that can be broken in a matter of minutes. (some girls are obviously too fucking selfish ) On the other hand one or two of my friends whom haven’t had religious upbringings, have turned/swayed towards Sikhi themselves naturally. One of my friends who also posts on here (well hasn’t for a while) has turned to Sikhi through his own research/interest/curosity as he gained more knowledge his love increased & now he has grown his beard & hair, & is knowledgable on Sikhi & aims to improve himself all the time, along with helping others on the path of Sikhi.

Getting back to topic a few girls do get caught in this so called ‘conversion trap’ not all but some, and when they do discuss their queries with close ones, they realise that the conversion isn’t the right thing for them & open their eyes to the lack of understanding they have on their own religion. There’s actually a few groups in the UK who go out and help/advise & look out for the girls families whom get caught up in the chase, it’s all out of goodwill, sometimes people do need the extra support to get by. But some chicks beg to differ & simply don’t connect within their own religion & convert. Each to their own.

I’ve mentioned this before on here & I’ll mention it again, you can turn away from Sikhi but it’ll always be there for you with open arms.


But one thing I can say is that many people aren’t scared of Sikhi but just aren’t ready to follow the 5 K’s fully. It’s all a learning curve, it’s about teaching & absorbing knowledge, after all knowledge is power….& a little always goes a long way. Sikhi is all about learning and everyone of us are on a different path spiritually. Live and let live.

Rab Rakha.

[PRCIV]

is dat bad or gewwwwwwd

Good, definitely good.

[punjabipride04]

is dat bad or gewwwwwwd
That's usually good :thumrigh:

you sound/type like her too :lol:

[PRCIV]

im told i look Indian alot... thats it tho.

I'm waiting for someone tell me I look Italian. That shall be the day I run down the street naked with joy !

[selina_786]

I'm waiting for someone tell me I look Italian. That shall be the day I run down the street naked with joy !
That's a paki mans dream to be told he looks Italiano. :ugh:

[crazy_meera1]

I'm waiting for someone tell me I look Italian. That shall be the day I run down the street naked with joy !




lolllll...u wud??


i've been told if im my best friends sister..

shes hispanic

ugh.

[crazy_meera1]

That's usually good :thumrigh:

you sound/type like her too :lol:


lolll...how do u know how she types?!?!

[PuNjabi_RaNi*]

Go read my post again cause your way to lost.

Basicully my message was this, girls that have low morals that ive seen, tend to not share a close relationships with their familys and this may have to do with boys being favoured over girls, as well they have no idea or clue about sikhi or sikh history, but their also girls that i have seen who have a close relationship with their family, their parants have educated them about sikhi, they have open communication with their parants were they can talk about anything, their parants have taken the time to teach them morals, and their parants trust them rather then make them feel like prisioners and these girls would never do anything and would never even think about anything that could hurt their parants. Cause they have high morals and they don't want to destroy that trust their parants have and their way to close with their parants to see them hurt.


TALK ABOUT THE GUYS WHO ARE DOING SHIT - OPEN YOUR MIND MISTER.

[punjabipride04]

lolll...how do u know how she types?!?!
She's my friends, mothers, sisters friend. :lol:

[di vinci]

im told i look Indian alot... thats it tho.i get told i look mexican/ spanish and irish

thats after 10pints of beer

[crazy_meera1]

She's my friends, mothers, sisters friend. :lol:


if thts true then

hrithik roshan is my moms moms husbands cousins cousin...

[di vinci]

chal aajaa ranjaa

lmfao.
nach nach sanjani

[crazy_meera1]

nach nach sanjani


LOL da fakk

is datt

[di vinci]

Blah, not again.

Seriously it's not he/it/the dog/parents/the goldfish


It's the girls! They have no one to blame but themselves. It's the same for many girls who are out of their parents sight. They let their hair down do things which wouldn't be accepted by their elders & just do their own thing I guess :dunno: Forget trying to say that the parents haven't educated them with Sikhi etc etc. I myself haven't been brought up in a religious environment at all, that doesn't mean it automatically provides me with the leeway to stray away from my religion & turn into some sort of little bombshell. A lot of these mixed relationships etc happen during university, where by most kids are more carefree. ‘When the cats away the mice will play’. There's many people dating different religions at my university, it's only when the chicks are stuck in 'bubble aka love land' that they begin thinking about conversion for 'love' & not religion, in which case is pretty lame.

Due to some of these conversions making it all the way to the press, only then have they been popping up more online/forums etc.

I know a good few paki chicks that have dated sikh guys aswell as other religions & whites. Along with sikh girls who date pakis/whites etc. They are pretty carefree whilst dating, but say they want to ‘experiment’ whilst young I guess. But that goes for many desi chicks. Heck even the guys date around different religions :google: . This is everywhere not just in the UK. But due to a large number of desi’s living within the UK many of whom live in highly dense desi poplulations there’s a higher probability of it occurring. But there’s also quite a few chicks who just stick to dating their own.



What you must understand is that many parents are even now oblivious when it comes to seein/believing the negativity within their own children. They easily pick fault out of others but rarely their own, that’s just a typical desi response to such a situation. Also, although it's hard for a desi girl to turn her back on her own family, but it’s not hard to live a double life. When someone gets used to something day in and day out their family becomes a blur, especially when they are so self absorbed into their boyfriends etc. But this happens in relationships full stop, my friends whom have dated etc, change as people whilst in relationships. One chick who used to be quite close to me, started to just dictate information her boyfriend told/advised her with, she's been dating within her own religion/caste etc..but now is definately not the same girl whom I knew 6 years ago unfortunately.



I disagee, I know girls who’ve been brought up beautifully by their parents have are nothing like their parents, even with the wise words and supporting guidance throughout their lives, they have little love for religion & rebel out of choice. Once you loose your child it’s hard to get them back trust wise etc. It can take a whole lifetime to build a solid level of trust with ones child but that can be broken in a matter of minutes. (some girls are obviously too fucking selfish ) On the other hand one or two of my friends whom haven’t had religious upbringings, have turned/swayed towards Sikhi themselves naturally. One of my friends who also posts on here (well hasn’t for a while) has turned to Sikhi through his own research/interest/curosity as he gained more knowledge his love increased & now he has grown his beard & hair, & is knowledgable on Sikhi & aims to improve himself all the time, along with helping others on the path of Sikhi.

Getting back to topic a few girls do get caught in this so called ‘conversion trap’ not all but some, and when they do discuss their queries with close ones, they realise that the conversion isn’t the right thing for them & open their eyes to the lack of understanding they have on their own religion. There’s actually a few groups in the UK who go out and help/advise & look out for the girls families whom get caught up in the chase, it’s all out of goodwill, sometimes people do need the extra support to get by. But some chicks beg to differ & simply don’t connect within their own religion & convert. Each to their own.

I’ve mentioned this before on here & I’ll mention it again, you can turn away from Sikhi but it’ll always be there for you with open arms.


But one thing I can say is that many people aren’t scared of Sikhi but just aren’t ready to follow the 5 K’s fully. It’s all a learning curve, it’s about teaching & absorbing knowledge, after all knowledge is power….& a little always goes a long way. Sikhi is all about learning and everyone of us are on a different path spiritually. Live and let live.

Rab Rakha.this is why i love you

[punjabimunda3000]

im not even gonna bother with someone who is beyond reasining with!!

your just confused.

[di vinci]

LOL da fakk

is datt
i dont know i aint desi

[punjabipride04]

if thts true then

hrithik roshan is my moms moms husbands cousins cousin...
God is my father.

[selina_786]

your just confused.
No she isn't. You just aren't trying to understand ffrom her perspective

[crazy_meera1]

i dont know i aint desi


what?

:O

i've been talking to a non desi


lol...so........... what are you?

[punjabipride04]

this is why i love you
Did you even read it? :rant:
I'm in the middle of my assignment yet procrastinating on here :bored:

[crazy_meera1]

God is my father.



:D alrity

[punjabipride04]

your just confused.
Omg krazie k got that quote from Jermaine Jackson.

I bet you 10rupees she has. :thumbdow:

[krazie k]

your just confused.

hell yeah im confused!!!

there, did that make you feel better?

[di vinci]

Did you even read it? :rant:
I'm in the middle of my assignment yet procrastinating on here :bored:
maybe i did.

actually i didnt. i can only stay focus for upto 1 paragraph then it goes down hill. short attention span

[DasJa]

I believe in shooting first and asking questions later
You've never picked a gun in yo life.....the internet gangsta thing is overplayed anyway homeslice.

[selina_786]

Omg krazie k got that quote from Jermaine Jackson.

I bet you 10rupees she has. :thumbdow:
:rofl: You have 1 sharp memory.

[punjabimunda3000]

hell yeah im confused!!!

there, did that make you feel better?

yes

[di vinci]

what?

:O

i've been talking to a non desi


lol...so........... what are you?
im welsh 75% of me is welshstani rest 25% im desi

[selina_786]

hell yeah im confused!!!

there, did that make you feel better?
Yes it does, mate.

I can smoke a fag on it.

Mofoz.

[krazie k]

Yes it does, mate.

I can smoke a fag on it.

Mofoz.
:rofl: :rofl:

[punjabipride04]

:rofl: You have 1 sharp memory.
Lulz!! :kekeke: ha!

[crazy_meera1]

im welsh 75% of me is welshstani rest 25% im desi



oh my..


i dont even know what a welsh is...


i cnt be bothered to look it up....

but koolll..:)

[DasJa]

oh my..


i dont even know what a welsh is...


i cnt be bothered to look it up....

but koolll..:)
YOU MUST BE AMERICAN

[PRCIV]

You've never picked a gun in yo life.....the internet gangsta thing is overplayed anyway homeslice.

Well first of all that's a metaphor, it doesn't mean I'm actually running around shooting people. Secondly, I have a .38 Smith & Wesson that I know how to use pretty well. Thirdly, I'm not threatening anyone so I'm not an "internet gangsta".

[crazy_meera1]

YOU MUST BE AMERICAN



lol........maybeeeeeee

[PuNjabi_RaNi*]

Blah, not again.

Seriously it's not he/it/the dog/parents/the goldfish


It's the girls! They have no one to blame but themselves. It's the same for many girls who are out of their parents sight. They let their hair down do things which wouldn't be accepted by their elders & just do their own thing I guess :dunno: Forget trying to say that the parents haven't educated them with Sikhi etc etc. I myself haven't been brought up in a religious environment at all, that doesn't mean it automatically provides me with the leeway to stray away from my religion & turn into some sort of little bombshell. A lot of these mixed relationships etc happen during university, where by most kids are more carefree. ‘When the cats away the mice will play’. There's many people dating different religions at my university, it's only when the chicks are stuck in 'bubble aka love land' that they begin thinking about conversion for 'love' & not religion, in which case is pretty lame.

Due to some of these conversions making it all the way to the press, only then have they been popping up more online/forums etc.

I know a good few paki chicks that have dated sikh guys aswell as other religions & whites. Along with sikh girls who date pakis/whites etc. They are pretty carefree whilst dating, but say they want to ‘experiment’ whilst young I guess. But that goes for many desi chicks. Heck even the guys date around different religions :google: . This is everywhere not just in the UK. But due to a large number of desi’s living within the UK many of whom live in highly dense desi poplulations there’s a higher probability of it occurring. But there’s also quite a few chicks who just stick to dating their own.



What you must understand is that many parents are even now oblivious when it comes to seein/believing the negativity within their own children. They easily pick fault out of others but rarely their own, that’s just a typical desi response to such a situation. Also, although it's hard for a desi girl to turn her back on her own family, but it’s not hard to live a double life. When someone gets used to something day in and day out their family becomes a blur, especially when they are so self absorbed into their boyfriends etc. But this happens in relationships full stop, my friends whom have dated etc, change as people whilst in relationships. One chick who used to be quite close to me, started to just dictate information her boyfriend told/advised her with, she's been dating within her own religion/caste etc..but now is definately not the same girl whom I knew 6 years ago unfortunately.



I disagee, I know girls who’ve been brought up beautifully by their parents and are nothing like them, even with all those wise words and constant support & guidance throughout their lives, they have little love for religion & rebel out of choice. Once you loose your child it’s hard to get them back trust wise etc. It can take a whole lifetime to build a solid level of trust with ones child but that can be broken in a matter of minutes. (some girls are obviously too fucking selfish ) On the other hand one or two of my friends whom haven’t had religious upbringings, have turned/swayed towards Sikhi themselves naturally. One of my friends who also posts on here (well hasn’t for a while) has turned to Sikhi through his own research/interest/curosity as he gained more knowledge his love increased & now he has grown his beard & hair, & is knowledgable on Sikhi & aims to improve himself all the time, along with helping others on the path of Sikhi.

Getting back to topic a few girls do get caught in this so called ‘conversion trap’ not all but some, and when they do discuss their queries with close ones, they realise that the conversion isn’t the right thing for them & open their eyes to the lack of understanding they have on their own religion. There’s actually a few groups in the UK who go out and help/advise & look out for the girls families whom get caught up in the chase, it’s all out of goodwill, sometimes people do need the extra support to get by. But some chicks beg to differ & simply don’t connect within their own religion & convert. Each to their own.

I’ve mentioned this before on here & I’ll mention it again, you can turn away from Sikhi but it’ll always be there for you with open arms.


But one thing I can say is that many people aren’t scared of Sikhi but just aren’t ready to follow the 5 K’s fully. It’s all a learning curve, it’s about teaching & absorbing knowledge, after all knowledge is power….& a little always goes a long way. Sikhi is all about learning and everyone of us are on a different path spiritually. Live and let live.

Rab Rakha.

Rab Rakha! :yes:

& yeah even the girls who have come from good families with great upbringing can rebel!

[illin]

cliffs?

[DasJa]

lol........maybeeeeeee
Either THAt, or a blonde in a desi's body. No one else is usually THAT dumb.

[di vinci]

The United Nations' Flawed Population Policy
by Huessey, Peter R.
Backgrounder #376


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(Archived document, may contain errors)

376 August 27, 1984 THE UNITED NATIONS FLAWED POPULATION POLICY INTRODUCTION I The United Nations I second World Population Conference met I for more than a week earlier this month in Mexico City. Predict ably, it called for greatly expanded funding for family planning assistance worldwide. Activities (UNFPA the conferencels chief sponsor, will no doubt receive the largest portion of any assistance increase. those Americans concerned with the rate and size of world wide I population.growth, the conference results probably appear reassur- ing. is being done to contain the dimensions of the population explo- sion. I The United Nations Fund for Population For I The assumption seems widespread that at least ltsomethingll In the past two years, in fact, Congress has already increased significantly the family planning account in the Foreign Assistance Act. Under the Reagan Administration, spending has risen from slightly more than 200 million to about $250 million, with the House of Representatives having authorized more than $300 million for FY 19

85. It would appear that Congress has anticipated the U.N. Population Conference request for expanded government support for family planning.

For those who believe that the population explosion is among the most troublesome crises facing mankind, however, the results of the Mexican conference and the congressional action should not be reassuring. Quite the contrary. The Conference results revealed a lack of intellectual honesty by the participants particularly the family planning boosters. It is not that family planning programs per se are not worthy of support. But the suggestion that their expansion will bring the rate of population growth downward is without foundation I About $50 million of this would go to UNFPA 2 The U.N. Fund for Population Activities plays a critical role in population-related programs worldwide officially takes a neutral stance toward the population policies adopted by its member governments, it is widely assumed by members of Congress and the American taxpayers that the UNFPA was not created to increase the world's population growth but to contain it. Indeed, when members of Congress vote year after year to support these programs they almost certainly do so convinced that the UNFPA, and organizations such as the U.S. Agency for Inter- national Development and the World Bank are doing something about the problem In fact, what UNFPA does is not very effec tive While the UNFPA This is clear from the proceedings in Mexico City. It should be obvious that economic growth and enhanced economic opportunity, given sufficient natural resources and spurred by free economies, can provide sufficient improvements in per capita living standards so that family size preference drops, in some cases drops rapidly. It should also be obvious that people in the developing world want large numbers of children, usually four to six per couple. Drowning them in contraceptives, therefore will not suddenly change decades of cultural tradition but will only waste money. As such, the central debate on population policy should be over the extent and adequacy of the natural resources base and how countries can, humanely and voluntarily change family size preferences. Ignored by the Mexico City Conference was the success of Singapore and South Korea, and to a more limited degree, Sri Lanka and Thailand, in linking social and economic incentives and disincentives to the adoption of the small family norm. In Singapore and South Korea, birth rates that were moving slightly upward were reversed and dropped sharply within five to seven years to where the two-child family is within reach It is true that many couples in the developing world want contraceptive service programs, but it is also true that these same couples want families of four to six children. Congress appears to ignore this. This is what makes family planning policy seem so paradoxical. On the one hand, support for family planning rests on the correct assumption that many couples want to use contraceptive services. On the pther hand, until there is a major change in family size preferences, population growth rates will not significantly fall, even with massive increases in program funding.

While it may be true, as recent surveys and studies in some developing countries reveal, that many couples desire contraceptive services, they want these services to allow them to space or plan large families and to prevent childbearing after four to six children have been born. The reports of large percentages of women desiring to cease or better plan childbearing, but not now using contraceptive services, are widely interpreted to mean that a large number of "unwanted1' children are being born. But this is not necessarily so. The fact that women may want fewer children 3 does not mean that these sentiments. are not necessarily shared by their husbands, who, for reasons of tradition and culture, often make the decisions about childbearing.

The evidence is overwhelming that couples in the developing world prefer families of four to six children; they desire such numbers of surviving children whether or not family planning services are available. The fact that many countries have adopted family planning programs is therefore largely immaterial. The programs will be effective only when people want smaller families.

This will happen only when they see the benefits of smaller families. And this requires improved living conditions and a vision of the future that is more hopeful and less fatalistic.

Whether or not the natural resources base is sufficient for development in the Third World to proceed at the same pace as in the industrialized world, and whether or not the population explosion is a key obstacle to a more secure and free world, the question for policy makers is whether dramatically increased expenditure for family planning is sound policy for the United States In fact, family planning programs in the developing world illustrated by the countries examined below, are characterized by ineffectiveness, waste, bureaucracy, and misdirection. The UNFPA's own studies acknowledge the failures of programs in Bangladesh, Pakistan, and elsewhere. It is time for an account ing of what the UNFPA does and whether it has had an impact. The American taxpayer no longer should be asked to support population policies that fail.

OVERVIEW The United Nations Fund for Population Activities (UNFPA was established following the 1965 World Population Conference in Belgrade. The United States has been the largest donor to the UNFPA, providing as much as 85 percent of its support during the 197Os.l Currently, the U.S. provides about one-quarter of the agency's $150 million budget. Funding is divided by functions such as data collection, research, educational programs, and the delivery of contraceptives (family planning.)2 West Germany and Japan, the next two largest donors, have increased their contributions by 65 percent over the 1979-1982 period, compared to a 14 percent increase during the same period for the U.S. The U.S however, has contributed over $1.3 billion 1 "1979-1983 Report," The United Nations Fund for Population Activities New York. Ibid. in cumulative overall population assistance since 1965, compared to $63 million for West Germany and $78.6 million for Japan.3 UNFPA has grown from a small trust fund of the U.N. Secretary General to an organization with a yearly program budget in excess of $150 million respond to virtually any request for population assistance.

Although ostensibly established to help less developed nations contain the explosive rate of population growth, the UNFPA does not attempt to influence any country to adopt any particular approach to population policy about only when couples make a conscious choice to have fewer children, the UNFPA operates under the framework of the World Population Plan of Action. This emphasizes the right of all couples to have the number of children they de~ire precisely the underlying cause of the population explosion the UNFPA maintains strict neutrality with respect to the particu lar population policy a nation might adopt combat infertility as well as programs, ostensibly, to combat high fertility. Its policies are little different than those traditionally pursued by both the World Bank and the U.S. Agency for International Development. The goal of UNFPA programs is simply to allow people Itof assisted countries to] have freedom to control their reproduction as they desire,Il5 which by and large they do in any case, irrespective of the U.N. confirming this freedom in over 140 different nations.6 Agencies, most of which have limited expertise on population matters and no organizational commitment to population activities.

As a result, a wide number of 'activities are funded,that have little to do with an overall population strategy. In addition UNFPA loses ultimate responsibility for implementation of many of its own programs. This in turn leads to the virtual absence of evaluative material on the objectives, accomplishments, and results of UNFPA projects.

UNFPA's help to over 30 nongovernmental organizations, such as the Population Council, the Population Action Council, the Popula tion Crisis Committee, and International Planned Parenthood Federation. This further diffuses UNFPAIs authority and control over projects and activities From the outset it has been UNFPA policy to Although recognizing that a decline in fertility will come Furthermore, It funds programs to The UNFPA has provided assistance to and is currently active It operates through other U.N Complicating matters even more is Ibid., and "1980 Report," The United Nations Fund for Population Activi ties, New York.

See resolution passed by the United Nations Conference on Population Bucharest, Romania, 1974, upon adoption of the United Nations Resolution on Population and Development.

Justin Blackwelder, Testimony before the House Subcommittee on Foreign Operations, U.S. House of Representatives, March 31, 1977, p. 398 1980 Report op. cit., pp. 108-149 and p. 19. 6 5 Table 1 UNFPA ASSISTANCE IN 1980, BY EXECUTING AGENCY Dol la rs United Nations Regional Economic Commissions IL FA0 UNESCO WHO UNIDO UNICEF UNFPA NGOs 31.1 6.8 6.0 3.9 6:6 23.8 0.1 10.2 42.2 19.8 Total $150.5 Percent 20.7 4.6 4.0 2.6 4.4 15.8 6.8 28.0 13.1 100 o UNFPA POLICY FRAMEWORK Although the UNFPA boasts that only about 8 percent of its budget is spent on administrative ~verhead the true price is the serious lack of managerial staff in countries in which UNFPA funds family planning and population activities. As a result there is little review of program expenditures. In some countries, for example, there may be but a single professional UNFPA staff member for all the programs. And because UNFPA funds just about any project, even remotely related to population, there is very little incentive to determine whether the program is meeting any objective UNFPA does not advocate a reduction in population growth within any single country.8 Indeed, UNFPA supports programs that ensure that all couples are able to achieve their desired number and spacing of ~hi1dren.I According to the most recent studies the world's inhabitants are now producing approximately the number of children they desire This will double the world's population every 35 years.1 This means that UNFPA is simply helping to ensure that the world's current 4.9 billion people reach 10 billion, and from there to 20 billion. UNFPA aids Bangladesh, for example, not to bring the nation's birth rate down, but because Bangladesh itself provides only limited support to its population programs and policies Ibid. 6 UNFPA PROGRAM ACTIVITIES From the time of its inception, UNFPA has secured over a billion dollars in contributions. It now has about 100 donors supporting its more than 500 projects.

UNFPA's specific population and family planning programs are divided into functional areas, including basic data collection 19 percent of its funds the study of population change (11 percent), formulation of population policies (5 percent) and their implementation (1 percent support for family planning maternal child health programs (42 percent and educational and communication programs (12 percent). The remaining 10 percent goes for miscellaneous projects and programs.12 The UNFPA has designated 40 countries to receive population assistance on a priority basis considered particularly acute received 42 percent of all assistance.13 their population problems are These countries generally have During 1980 to 1983, UNFPA spent nearly $30 million annually on basic data collection, including population censuses, vital statistics collection, and demographic and population-related studies.

Basic population research, policy formulation, and implemen tation form the link between the collection of population data and its subsequent analysis and utilization. Over $26 million was expended in these areas in 1980, dropping to $21 million in 1983 the economic and social variables associated with fertility mortality, and migration research and training facilities within the developing world to increase the knowledge of the causes, consequences and determinants of population growth. Coupled with such research activities is population policy formulation, which generally involves assistance to national governments in adopting the necessary laws and legal instruments to establish a national family planning and maternal and child health program. Two additional areas are of concern for the UNFPA 1) insuring that population policies are inte grated into overall development activities; and (2) taking into account population factors when formulating national development plans This included demographic training and research concerning The aim of this project is to establish Much has been made of UNFPA efforts in this area. Although impressive at first glance, such assistance has resulted in population and family planning activities being buried in various ministries of health or education, primarily focused on maternal l2 "1980 Report op. cit p. 18 l3 Ibid p. 19. 7 and child health programs, child spacing, and reducing the inci dence of abortion. As a result, efforts to reduce desired family size and birth rates are abandoned tion factors means mentioning the subject in lengthy Ifdevelopment plans" and acknowledging that, as the population grows, the number of classrooms and teachers, for example, also needs to be increased. The idea that none of this makes any difference never seems to occur to the UNFPA. Both Pakistan and Bangladesh, for example, have had innumerable changes in ministry names and functions and long ago acknowledged population growth as a key development factor. Nevertheless, the birth rates in both coun tries have remained stationary for the past twenty years, while the population growth rates have increased tage of UNFPA funds, with $63 million allocated for these purposes in 1980, and $54 million allocated in 19

83. Programs to deliver modern means of contraception are almost universally integrated or folded into existing national strategies for the Ilreduction of maternal and infant morbidity and mortalityi1 (which will cause I the population to grow more rapidly). Thus, family planning I services are seen as programs that people and government want need, or request. The aim of the program administrators is to I see that modern contraceptives are llaccepted, accessible, and safe and effective,I1l4 regardless of whether people have four five, or six children It is thus paradoxical that the desire for large numbers of children, precisely the central cause of the population explosion which UNFPA is ostensibly trying to slow, is a desire that UNFPA encourages Taking into accountll'popula Family planning assistance receives the overwhelming percen Through radio, television, booklets, films, exhibitions, and training materials, UNFPA stresses the importance of using contra ceptives or family planning-but not of achieving the small family size norm. Thus the fact that requests keep increasing for UNFPA activities does not necessarily mean that birth rate levels will drop if the requests are honored.

A major accomplishment of UNFPA during 1981, according to its senior officials, was not success in bringing'birth rates down, but the convocation of an international family planning conference. The conference decided to expand the availability accessibility, and acceptabilityll of Ilfamily planning services and to sustain and increase" the national and international financial commitment to family planning programs In short, more money was to be committed to UNFPA, irrespective of program success. This message was recycled at this month's Mexico City conference 14 Ibid pp. 24-26 8 UNFPA COUNTRY PROGMS UNFPA projects in some of illustrate how the U.N. agency the largest less developed nations spends its assistance funds.

Nigeria Although the government of Nigeria apparently does not see population growth as a detriment to economic development or living standards, the UNFPA is providing $2 million to Nigeria for the period 1980-1984 (in addition to $3.7 million provided between 1971 and 1980 In fact, the Nigerian national develop ment plan places primary emphasis upon the reduction of maternal and child mortality, not birth rates.

UNFPA support largely has been limited to computer management to assist the government in the collection of population statistics and to conduct a national fertility survey, which will reveal that the average number of children per Nigerian couple is extreme ly high--something that most observers already know.

Despite no change in the extremely high Nigerian birth rate however, UNFPA claims that the family planning programs "continued to perform After visiting Nigeria in 1980, a UNFPA needs assessment missionll concluded that additional support was warranted for further expansion of family planning and maternal and child health activities.17 in no change in the national birth rate, why would an expanded UNFPA program be warranted?

If past UNFPA efforts have resulted UNFPA has provided $20 million to the Egyptian population programs. Nearly $3 million was awarded in 1978 for a population development program.18 Its goals include: (1) improving the family planning services offered in the country program, (2) ex panding efforts in education, motivation, and communication, and 3) raising the standard of living at the community level in the hope that this will encourage a smaller family size norm 15 16 17 18 It should be noted that numbers used here refer to direct UNFPA expendi tures by country through 1983 and do not include (1) funds channeled through an intermediary organization, such as the 1PP.F (International Planned Parenthood Federation) or UNESCO, and (2) funds spent for what are known as inter-regional programs, that is funds spent by various research organizations such as the Population Council or Population Crisis Committee. The funds spent in these regional and interregional programs over the last two years (1982 and 1983) have totaled approxi mately $70 million 1980 Report op. cit p. 40 Ibid., p. 41 Inventory of Population Projects in Developing Countries Around the World Population Programs and Projects, United Nations Fund for Popula tion Activities, pp. 122-123. 9 Though its population problem is recognized by Egypt's leadership as particularly serious, the actual implementation of population policy has not received much attention directed for considerable periods of time by individuals and organizations hostile to the policies of family planning and the need for population stabilization policies.

Two years ago, Egyptian President Hosni Mubarak war,ned that the present rate of population increase'obstructs economic development and shatters our hopes for securing a prosperous life for every Egyptian." He added that, with the current population of 44 million projected to rise to 70 million by the year 2000 efforts to provide sufficient food, shelter, employment, health and education for all Egyptians will be crippled unless the population problem is contr01led.l It has been I During early 1980, it appeared that senior Egyptian popula tion policy officials were considering a program that would have awarded economic assistance to those villages with significant declines in birth rates.20 This, however, does not appear to have been implemented.

Population assistance to Egypt was started by UNFPA in 1971.

An initial four-year, $5.8 million program consisted of supplies of contraceptives, establishing new and upgrading existing family planning units, and a number of research and management activities.

In 1975, a UNFPA evaluation team visited Egypt to review family planning activities. Despite an increasing birth rate, a new agreement was established with Egypt in 1977, calling for about 10 million in additional assistance,21 with little if any change in program activities.

Mexico UNFPA assistance to Mexico was initiated in 1972 with a $1.4 million program. It was expanded in 1975 to $8,855,0

00. It funded medical services for maternal and child health and family planning programs, involving about 1,500 health centers, with the aim of assisting in a glanned, gradual expansion of such services into the rural areas.2 planning program with $6.3 million committed for an additional In 1979, UNFPA extended its support for the Mexican family l9 "Development Rates Must Match Population Growth Address by President Hosni Mibarak of Egypt, as reported in The Egyptian Gazette, February 14 19

82. D. 1. 2o Repoit-by Ambassador Marshall Green, Egyptian and Pakistan Mission February 9, 1981, pp. 5-6 Inventory of Population Projects in Developing Countries Around the World op. cit p. 121 22 m p. 122. 10 3+year period.23 of services to marginal rural and urban areas, including informa- tion, communication, and educational activities. Within a year UNFPA approved an additional package of assistance in the amount of $10.56 million for the next five years The emphasis of this program is on the extension Brazil The Brazilian government wants to maintain the current rates of population growth as part of an effort to settle the country's north and west regions. UNFPA activity in Brazil therefore has been limited to a demonstration project in Rio de Janeiro, offer ing maternal and child health, as well as family planning services to some of the marginal areas of the approved by the UNFPA in June of 1979, and consisted of $1.1 million in project support over a two-year period, with the Brazilian government contributing $1.4 million. (Overall, the UNFPA has spent but $2.7 million in this country of 120 million The project was Bangladesh Bangladesh has received $28.2 million in UNFPA assistance since 19

74. The U.N. agency has supported over 40 population and family planning projects of one kind or another. Programs have been renewed regularly, despite the overwhelming evidence demon strating that there has been no decline in the national birth rate.

UNFPA programs have included maternal and child health and family planning services, sterilization services in hospitals and health centers, and mobile sterilization teams to serve rural and remote areas. One project initiated in 1980 called for an assess ment of the demographic impact of the family planning delivery system; this should have been relatively easy since the national birth rate has remained unchanged for the past 20 years.

India UNFPA assistance to India began in 1974 with a five-year $40 million grant. By the following year, six family planning projects had become operational; by the middle o.f the year, other projects had been launched planning services and information and education programs within the country's national health care system and within the organized labor sector. Additional activities focused on .the local produc tion of contraceptives and the delivery of equipment and supplies Objectives have been to establish family By far, the greatest UNFPA effort between 1976 and 1979 was the direct support of family planning activities, including the 23 Ibid p. 270. 24 Ibid p. 271. 11 construction of over 800 rural family welfare planning centers the training of 5,000 new auxiliary nurse midwives and 1,250 new Lady Health Visitors, and the training of medical officers supervisors and other workers at both the state and local level for the Primary Health Centers Over $47 million was spent solely in training traditional birth attendants in I'sound mid wifery A total of $77 million has been spent by UNFPA over the past decade.

Pakistan UNFPA so far has spent $20 million in population assistance to Pakistan. These outlays purchased transport (such as boats jeeps, scooters, bicycles, and spare parts contraceptives medicines, and medical equipment; consultants and advisers; fel lowships and study tours; training, research, and evaluation ac tivities; clinical and basic medical research; maternity-centered family planning services; salary supplements for family planning and health field workers and salaries for 5,000 new field workers called lady motivators and lady welfare visitors.

UNFPA PROGRAM COMMENTARY From 1971 to 1982, the UNFPA spent nearly $230 million in The recipients are an extremely diverse the ten largest less developed nations, some of which are nations cited in this report group ranging from Catholic to Muslim, dictatorial to quasi- democratic, capitalistic to socialistic, 50 million population to over 700 million, and a few years to nearly three decades of ex perience with population programs and efforts. Despite this variety, the UNFPA programs in these countries are strikingly similar.

Contraceptive services are made available through clinics teams of midwives, bureaucrats and motivators are hired to encour age people to use contraceptives, and depots and vehicles are provided to store contraceptives and disburse them through the community. These programs change very little from year to year despite the noticeable lack of progress in such countries as Nigeria, Pakistan, Bangladesh, Egypt, and India.

In Brazil meanwhile, UNFPA ignores what has been happening as the national birth rate has been dropping from 40 to 32 per thousand without government supported family planning (services were available largely through commercial outlets the U.S. AID programs of the past 20 years. From 1965 to 1977 for example, AID was dominated by the It contraceptive inundationt1 theory of population limitation. Family planning enthusiasts chagrined at the noticeable lack of progress in reducing birth rates, decided on a novel approach. Their most noted advocate R.T. Rayenholt, the former director of AID'S Population Office, argued that inundating the developing world with condoms, pills and IUDs would result in everyone using the devices The pattern of UNFPA programs is not surprising; they mirror 12 AID launched such a program in Pakistan in 19

76. Condoms were produced in red, white, and blue in celebration of the U.S bicentennial Try a new experience1' was emblazoned on them.

AID supplies of contraceptives sent to developing countries were often doubled, even if existing supplies were not being utilized.

This was described as Ilprogramming for success It UNFPA policies are simply the legacy of this inundation philosophy.

Despite the failure of UNFPA programs to significantly affect birth rates in Bangladesh, Nigeria, Pakistan, India Egypt, and Mexico, UNFPA continues to support programs that differ little from the failed policies of the early 1970s. Even after detailed assessments in the late 1970s of Bangladesh India, and the Philippines, UNFPA program support continued un changed despite evidence that project management, implementation and formulation were seriously deficient In addition, the June 1979 recommendation in the Indonesian program assessment that community incentive policies be adopted to spur fertility decline was not followed up by UNFPA. Similarly the Bangladesh assessment of September 1978 notes that community participation in incentive programs was critical for program suc cess. However, the UNFPA simply continued its previous contra ceptive distribution schemes without an assessment of whether sufficient demand existed for their utilization.

Although the impact of population growth on economic develop ment has been established for decades, additional millions have been spent on research on the l'interrelationships between develop ment and popu1ation.I' Despite the obvious connection between a rapidly increasing population and major increase in a nation's labor force, scarce resources are spent demonstrating this rela tionship over and over again of the National Family Planning Communication,I' begun in 1977 was to be Itstrengthenedit again, just two years after being estab lished. And communication programs, designed to complement and assist the family planning service aspects of population policy are being shifted to focus "real support to such programs, I' rais ing the question of what it was these communication programs were doing in the first place.25 One program entitled IIStrengthening UNFPA recommendations and policy objectives often appear to be couched in equivocations and meaningless generalities was a key recommendation following a 1979 assessment of the Indonesian population program 26 Complementary action should also be taken to train and direct the attention of anthropologists/rural sociolo gists in concerned institutions and the social science Typical 25 "Inventory of Population Projects in Developing Countries Around the World 1979-1980 op. cit pp. 340-343 26 m pp. 414-417 13 research training centers to the potential use of micro study data for communication planning and strategy development to the quantitative information needs of the population/family planning communication program and to the consequent new training and research direc tions to be developed by the institutions concerned.

Such assessments indicate that UNFPA program administrators are far removed from the serious population problems facing developing nations and generally oblivious to the new directions in which population policies should move. UNFPA staffers apparently believe that they have made an important decision regarding communication activities when they change projects using film to ones which use synchronized slide-sound systems or transparencies. Such policy and program recommendations are the rule rather than the exception CONCLUSION UNFPA Executive Director, Rafael Salas, concedes that family planning programs do not succeed tries in which birth rates declined modestly between 1960 and 1980 UNFPA acknowledges that the Itfamily planning programs have merely reinforced an already existing trend toward fertility decline."

Further, UNFPA questions why Ifcouples in developing countries are not taking full advantage of the [contraceptive] services offered" and provides the right answer prevailing are the legacy of a long cultural tradition which has encouraged large-sized families. However, we have tended to assume that couples who want large families are behaving in an irrational fashion, in fact, they merely do not share our values regarding family size.Il Even in those Third World cpun The high levels of fertility And in a remarkable display of candor, UNFPA declares, again correctly, that Ilpopulation policies are too often confused with family planning,Il explaining that "It is important that we not look at family planning programs as the panacea to the world's population problems. While family planning programs will help couples to have the number of children they wish, other economic and social factors lie behind their ideas of desired family size." In another statement, UNFPA concludes It has been clear for a long time that family planning campaigns are largely ineffectual in producing a lower rate of population growth been operating for more than a decade in most of the countries surveyed in this report programs do not control population growth, UNFPA appears unwilling UNFPA population and family planning service programs have Despite growing evidence that these 27 Ibid p 415. to change policy or to move in new directions the meager impact of UNFPA population programs:28 The data illustrate Country Bangladesh Brazil Egypt India Indonesia Mexico Nigeria Pakistan Philippines UNFPA Program Start 1974 1977 1971 1974 1972 1972 1975 1970 1972 Table 2 Year(s 1974 1980-1981 1977 1980-1981 197 1 1980-1981 1974 1980-1981 1972 1980-1981 1972 1980-1981 1975 1980-1981 1970 1980-1981 1972 1980-1981 Births per 1000 46 46 32 31 38 42-43 38 37-38 41-42 35-38 43 38-41 49 49 45 45 41 36 Growth Rate percent 2.6 2.8 2.4 2.3 2.3 3.0 1 2.2 2.3 2.1-2.3 2.3 I 3.6 3.5 2.7 3.2 2.7 I 2.9 2.7 2.7 c Growth rate figures used in this table refer to rates.of natural increase and exclude emigration figures. Birth rate figures refer to benchmark data or rates calculated from comparisons of rates of natural increase with estimated death rates As Table 2 illustrates, UNFPA family planning assistance programs appear to have had little impact on the. birth rate levels in Pakistan, Bangladesh, India, Egypt, Brazil, and Nigeria 28 U.S. Bureau of the Census, Department of Commerce World Population Reports in 1975"--1977--1979 and--1981; and "Demographic Estimates of Countries With a Population of 10 Million or More the Census, Department of Commerce. See also "Country Demographic Profiles Mexico, Thailand, India, Indonesia, Brazil, Pakistan, and Bangladesh U.S. Bureau of the Census, U.S. Department of Commerce 1981 U.S. Bureau of 15 As far. as Mexico, Indonesia, and the Philippines are concerned birth rates there appear to have declined during UNFPA program activities. However, birth rate declines prior to family planning program initiatives b UNFPA appear to have generally matched subsequent declines 2r Table 3 Country Mexico Indonesia Philippines UNFPA Program Date 1972 1972 1972 Birth Rate History 1972-1980 1964-1972 43-38 49-43 5 pt. drop 6 pt. drop 4011-3518 46-40/1 2-6 pt. drop 5-6 pt. drop 41-36 47-41 5 pt. drop 6 pt. drop In the case of Mexico, for example, a drop of 5 points in the national birth rate between 1972 and 1980 appears to have been matched by the drop in the national birth rate in the eight years prior to the initiation of UNFPA family planning programs. In Indonesia and the Philippines, the birth rate appears to have decreased prior to the initiation of UNFPA family planning programs at a rate equal to or greater than those rates of decline subse quent to program establishment (over the same period of time I 29 The Census Bureau, from which these data are taken, generally projects birth rate estimates on the assumption that trends generally are moving downward. This report prefers to rely upon benchmark data contained in the Census Bureau reports and publications, as they are usually based upon actual data rather than optimistic assessments of what might be hap pening. Where a range of estimates has been given by the U.S. Census Bureau, the midpoint has been used, e.g., in the case of Bangladesh, the birth rate estimates range from 44-48 per .1000 100 as the midpoint between these two estimates. Where birth rate esti mates were unavailable for a particular year, an estimate was used that was roughly midway between available estimates before and after a par ticular year The table uses 46 per Of particular importance are recent census results from such coun tries as India, Indonesia, and the Philippines, which have revealed popu lation totals significantly higher than-previous estimates had assumed would be the case. For example, the Indonesian 1980 Census revealed that the Indonesian population had grown by 28.2 million between 1971 (the year of the last census) and 1980, with a corresponding average growth rate of well in excess of 2 percent a year between 1975-1980, despite optimistic projections that showed a decline to below 2 percent 16 The desired family size in nine of the ten countries in Table 4 exceeds four children. As a result, should family plan ning programs be 100 percent successful, and eliminate all unwanted child bearing, the populations of each of these nations would double each generation. The story is similar for other nations.

Between 1970 and 1983, for example, according to AID testimony before House Appropriations Committee during the hearing on the l?Y 1984 Foreign Assistance Act, the birth rates of twelve African Asian, and Latin American countries increased even though the governments supported family programs. In an additional nine nations receiving U.S. family planning assistance, birth rates remained unchanged.



More important, however, the world's annual average rate of population growth between 1980 and 1983 was 1.8 percent annually up from 1.7 percent during the previous decade. world, excluding Mainland China, population growth rates remained at 2.4 percent annually between 1960 and 1977, during which time family planning programs greatly expanded. Since then, despite the increased expenditures for family planning, Third World population growth rates may have increased to the 2.5 to 2.6 percent level, the first such increase in nearly 25 years has remained unchanged in the great majority of Third World countries:30 In the developing Of great significance, however, is that desired family size Table 4 Desired Number of Children Per Couple 1960- 1965 1975- 1980 Indonesia Thai land Phi 1 ipp ine s India Pakistan Brazil Egypt Nigeria Mexico Bangladesh 4.3 3.7 5.0 4.1 4.0 4.0 (est 4.0 (est 4.5 (est 3.5 4.3 4.4 4.2 4.2 4.4 4.0 (est 6.0 4.5 (est 4.1 3.8 Population assistance programs in most areas of the develop ing world are limited in scope and effectiveness, for they are primarily family planning programs. Family planning programs can succeed if desired family size norms substantially and significant ly change from the

[crazy_meera1]

Either THAt, or a blonde in a desi's body. No one else is usually THAT dumb.


man da fakk

yur prolly like 100th person who told me...


NEWAYS WHO EVER ELSE HAS TO SAY THIS TO ME...MITE AS WELL NOT..

COZ ISS RETARDED........WHO CARES WHT A WELSH IS NEWAYS.

[punjabipride04]

Wtf vincihomodi! :no:


Thanks for acknowledging my post PR phenji :hug:

[PakPlaya69]

I cant believe every one in this thread has missed the most important reason behind these mass conversions .. its the CHARM of pakistani male , it ain the religion nor the pressure but the charm that brings them to us in greater numbers .. :Pelvic2:

[di vinci]

Wtf vincihomodi! :no:


Thanks for acknowledging my post PR phenji :hug:
i can sound intelligent too;)

[illin]

when will dumbass desis ever learn

[punjabipride04]

I cant believe every one in this thread has missed the most important reason behind these mass conversions .. its the CHARM of pakistani male , it ain the religion nor the pressure but the charm that brings them to us in greater numbers .. :Pelvic2:
That certainly doesn't include you so fix up.

[crazy_meera1]

I cant believe every one in this thread has missed the most important reason behind these mass conversions .. its the CHARM of pakistani male , it ain the religion nor the pressure but the charm that brings them to us in greater numbers .. :Pelvic2:


lol oh man....another one.....

[PuNjabi_RaNi*]

Wtf vincihomodi! :no:


Thanks for acknowledging my post PR phenji :hug:
You made a lotta sense - anyhow thing's ok? :hug:

[selina_786]

I cant believe every one in this thread has missed the most important reason behind these mass conversions .. its the CHARM of pakistani male , it ain the religion nor the pressure but the charm that brings them to us in greater numbers .. :Pelvic2:PRCIV!

[DasJa]

man da fakk

yur prolly like 100th person who told me...


NEWAYS WHO EVER ELSE HAS TO SAY THIS TO ME...MITE AS WELL NOT..

COZ ISS RETARDED........WHO CARES WHT A WELSH IS NEWAYS.
:werd:


Anything outside America is a damn hell-hole prolly eh?







Good job sista :high5:

[PuNjabi_RaNi*]

man da fakk

yur prolly like 100th person who told me...


NEWAYS WHO EVER ELSE HAS TO SAY THIS TO ME...MITE AS WELL NOT..

COZ ISS RETARDED........WHO CARES WHT A WELSH IS NEWAYS.
:rofl:

[PRCIV]

PRCIV!

I warned you it was coming

[PakPlaya69]

That certainly doesn't include you so fix up.


thats alright i still pull more sikh gals than you .. yeh i kno you are a female :ugh:

[crazy_meera1]

:rofl:



lol.......yesh..how may i help u today?

[crazy_meera1]

:werd:


Anything outside America is a damn hell-hole prolly eh?







Good job sista :high5:


yeha...watt
i thought u were in uk or something.....?!

[punjabipride04]

thats alright i still pull more sikh gals than you .. yeh i kno you are a female :ugh:
MY last user title was bipride.

[PuNjabi_RaNi*]

I cant believe every one in this thread has missed the most important reason behind these mass conversions .. its the CHARM of pakistani male , it ain the religion nor the pressure but the charm that brings them to us in greater numbers .. :Pelvic2:
Yeah such a charm - that toilet duck bleach you have in the background is so sexy. lol

[krazie k]

Yeah such a charm - that toilet duck bleach you have in the background is so sexy. lol


:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

[PakPlaya69]

MY last user title was bipride.

With these mass conversions it ll some become muslim pride :D

[PuNjabi_RaNi*]

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
LOL behnji twada naa kiya?

[krazie k]

LOL behnji twada naa kiya?


lol kiran

[PakPlaya69]

Yeah such a charm - that toilet duck bleach you have in the background is so sexy. lol

It worked in your case didn it?? soon my charm will make you ask me what exactly was i doing in there .. or i can always put a fake pic on , cant i?? :cool:

[PuNjabi_RaNi*]

lol kiran
Mmm acha, last name? :kekeke:

Nabina here -)

[selina_786]

Mmm acha, last name? :kekeke:

Nabina here -)
kaur innit

[punjabipride04]

It worked in your case didn it?? soon my charm will make you ask me what exactly was i doing in there .. or i can always put a fake pic on , cant i?? :cool:

what what in the butt

[PuNjabi_RaNi*]

kaur innit
Hahaha i should have knew :lol:

[krazie k]

kaur innit

kiran kaur sohi lol

[Snow-White]

Aren't like pakistani punjabi's the same as sikhs. They actually are, it's funny how you guys go on like you are two different races.

[selina_786]

Hahaha i should have knew :lol:
:lol:

[selina_786]

kiran kaur sohi lolHAHA!

[selina_786]

Aren't like pakistani punjabi's the same as sikhs. They actually are, it's funny how you guys go on like you are two different races.
Are you bengali? Oh right.

Damn someone needs to make a thread on bengali girls, do their families not care or anything?

[PakPlaya69]

what what in the butt

may be .. ;)

[PuNjabi_RaNi*]

Aren't like pakistani punjabi's the same as sikhs. They actually are, it's funny how you guys go on like you are two different races.

EH VEKHO SNOW WHITE AAGAYE, WOH SAAT DWARF KITE GAYE KURIYE?


:lol:

[Snow-White]

Are you bengali? Oh right.

Damn someone needs to make a thread on bengali girls, do their families not care or anything?



You know what i ain't even going to bother with you, you obviously are some sad big nose paki - punjabi whatever spending all day on ratedesi because you aint allowed out.

[selina_786]

I seriously didn't know you get toilet duck in Australasia

[selina_786]

You know what i ain't even going to bother with you, you obviously are some sad big nose paki - punjabi whatever spending all day on ratedesi because you aint allowed out.
No, you really aren't bothering are you?

[Snow-White]

EH VEKHO SNOW WHITE AAGAYE, WOH SAAT DWARF KITE GAYE KURIYE?


:lol:


Hehe, umm i don't know how to really speak it, erm seven dwarfs mera saath heh


:lol:

[krazie k]

You know what i ain't even going to bother with you, you obviously are some sad big nose paki - punjabi whatever spending all day on ratedesi because you aint allowed out.



hahahahahaha hmm im sure we went out earlier selina?? hmm :rofl:

[PuNjabi_RaNi*]

Hehe, umm i don't know how to really speak it, erm seven dwarfs mera saath heh


:lol:
Erm.

[selina_786]

wait, snow white has a wide ass man nose too. What she talking about, yo?

[RacingSoul]

Aren't like pakistani punjabi's the same as sikhs. They actually are, it's funny how you guys go on like you are two different races.

ur pretty good looking for a bangladeshi.


FAKE!

[selina_786]

hahahahahaha hmm im sure we went out earlier selina?? hmm :rofl:
nah, Im sure we were dreaming lol

[PuNjabi_RaNi*]

You know what i ain't even going to bother with you, you obviously are some sad big nose paki - punjabi whatever spending all day on ratedesi because you aint allowed out.
You aint no snow white :slap: hope the dwarfs make you into a curry.

[krazie k]

You know what i ain't even going to bother with you, you obviously are some sad big nose paki - punjabi whatever spending all day on ratedesi because you aint allowed out.

omfdz why is it always da nose dat gets picked on
:rofl: :rofl:

[Snow-White]

You aint no snow white :slap: hope the dwarfs make you into a curry.



Yeah i did lash out, sorry .. But she did go into my race..

[selina_786]

omfdz why is it always da nose dat gets picked on
:rofl: :rofl:
:rofla:

[selina_786]

Yeah i did lash out, sorry .. But she did go into my race..
hurts dont it? Don't dish it if you cannot lump it

[PuNjabi_RaNi*]

omfdz why is it always da nose dat gets picked on
:rofl: :rofl:
hahahahaha

[Snow-White]

ur pretty good looking for a bangladeshi.


FAKE!



Erm, Don't even go there..


I have enough people on ratedesi who know me, seriously to many local people here to prove its me and also i can make a pic with my name on it......thats when its critical..i wont just for you.

[PuNjabi_RaNi*]

Erm, Don't even go there..


I have enough people on ratedesi who know me, seriously to many local people here to prove its me and also i can make a pic with my name on it......thats when its critical..i wont just for you.

Are you peaches and cream?

Shammi? :shock:

[Snow-White]

hurts dont it? Don't dish it if you cannot lump it




Tut - This is why i have no desi girlfriends.....

[shahzadi88]

i feel like smackin the fuck out of u

[Snow-White]

Are you peaches and cream?

Shammi? :shock:



Lol, no.

Im me. I dont know them, Im a newbie remember.

[PuNjabi_RaNi*]

Tut - This is why i have no desi girlfriends.....
Gorey will just stab you in the back.

[Snow-White]

Gorey will just stab you in the back.




I haven't experienced that.
Nearly all my pakistani 'friends' have stabbed me in the back....literally!

I dont meet many Sikh's or Indians, so i cant say..

[*PrOjeCT KaL]

looks like ppl are bashing sikhi again...

[RacingSoul]

Erm, Don't even go there..


I have enough people on ratedesi who know me, seriously to many local people here to prove its me and also i can make a pic with my name on it......thats when its critical..i wont just for you.

take a chill pill woman...i've just never seen a decent looking bangladeshi.

[selina_786]

I haven't experienced that.
Nearly all my pakistani 'friends' have stabbed me in the back....literally!

I dont meet many Sikh's or Indians, so i cant say..
Then youre probably dumb.

You gotta be smart to survive in this world, and especially since you live in the uk.

Pakis/whites all the same. Whites are very canniving also, and are only there when you got money and time, yes with girls too.

I have a mixture of friends and have observed this shit, deep down.. all of them are the same.

[PuNjabi_RaNi*]

Yeah desi's are just as worse.

[PakPlaya69]

I haven't experienced that.
Nearly all my pakistani 'friends' have stabbed me in the back....literally!

I dont meet many Sikh's or Indians, so i cant say..


They probably didn see your front else no one in their right mind would wana stab you in the back

[selina_786]

I haven't experienced that.
Nearly all my pakistani 'friends' have stabbed me in the back....literally!

I dont meet many Sikh's or Indians, so i cant say..
then again, I can see why you probably feel they stabbed you in the back.

You feel you can get away with saying anything, yet others should watch their mouth incase you put a sterotype on them and stop associating with the whole race.

[*PrOjeCT KaL]

They probably didn see your front else no one in their right mind would wana stab you in the back
wata fuckn prick... :rofl:

[selina_786]

wata fuckn prick... :rofl:lol he kills it sometimes

[*PrOjeCT KaL]

lol he kills it sometimes
you gets me blud... and man dem tink hes playa and dat

hows you doing? :wavey:

[selina_786]

you gets me blud... and man dem tink hes playa and dat

hows you doing? :wavey:
not bad cheers, whats your take on this thread? lol

[*PrOjeCT KaL]

not bad cheers, whats your take on this thread? lol
lets not even go there, these threads simply just shouldnt be allowed, some of theses stats they get for threads like this (religion based) where the hell do they get em.

guy who startd threads been banned so enuff said lol

[selina_786]

lets not even go there, these threads simply just shouldnt be allowed, some of theses stats they get for threads like this (religion based) where the hell do they get em.

guy who startd threads been banned so enuff said lol
I understand everything but the religion part.

Sure some girls may convert religion but then again these girls aren't religious in the first place and neither are the ones convertin them.

so, crapy thread.

[SSSash]

excuse me i didnt say you said that i asked you a question, so chill before you bust a blood vessel!!

Lol totally ignored the bottom paragraph :rofl:

[Snow-White]

take a chill pill woman...i've just never seen a decent looking bangladeshi.



You just haven't been out much.


And besides your Indian, you can talk.

[di vinci]

these pucking pakistani come and steal our women. iv seen it a like a zillion time. when will we stand up and take our females back. power to the people