Hey Muslims!!!!

[NeRgYz]

so, we were having some discussions about organs donations and found out that there were only 3 donors in my class .....i wanted to b a donor too but i was said that its haram to donate your organs coz they are Allah's "amanat"....but isnt it sunnat to save someone's life??.....are u willing to donate ur organs too??

btw, if anyone of you take this as a joke, U R IN THE WRONG THREAD!!!!

[maryammmm]

hmm this is interesting ... i also wanna know the answer!


i never heard that it was haraam though...

[shadyzgal08]

my dad said it was ok to do
but mind you, he doesn't really know much about religion, he just thinks he does lol
but yeah as soon as i turn 18 i wanna go on the list
and i dont really care if its haram or not, i would rather try to save someone's life

[lil_desi_babe]

Your a good person :yes:

srry i dont know :ashamed:

[PakiRican]

good question
i hope we will get a good response
doubt it though

[Riddemz]

what do you think is right and wrong in this situation?
do you think its wrong to save someones life even if you stay alive at it?
if so then dont do it

if you think its right then do it
dont you think god prefers you saving someone else instead of following those rules?

hell even if it were a sin, and even if what you believed in was true, even if there was such a thing as heaven and hell
god would still know that you did it in good intentions and so there wouldnt be anything wrong with it

punishing you for a good intention would be rather evil... and im hoping that you dont think that god is evil

[HybridIndian]

I dont recall reading anywhere in the Quran whether its haraam to donate an organ -- for obvious reasons. Therefore, whatever people say nowadays on this topic is strictly their interpretation on the Quran and Hadiths.

So, keeping that in mind, I wont believe anyone if they told me that its haraam because in the end, it can only do good.

Disclaimer: This is my personal opinion so lay off the onslaught of insults and 'kafir' comments.

[TheLoneAvenger]

so, we were having some discussions about organs donations and found out that there were only 3 donors in my class .....i wanted to b a donor too but i was said that its haram to donate your organs coz they are Allah's "amanat"....but isnt it sunnat to save someone's life??.....are u willing to donate ur organs too??

btw, if anyone of you take this as a joke, U R IN THE WRONG THREAD!!!!

There's some debate as to whether it's allowed Islamically. Basically the two schools of though oppose (one allowing and one disallowing).

It doesn't desecrate the body and it gives on going charity after life, plus I don't think I've ever heard of a Muslim refusing an organ transplant. Based on this, I'm fine with organ donation and have no moral qualms about it.

[ilyas@!!oops!!]

yeh it is haram 100% because your soul is still alive when your dead

so you will feel the pain if someone was to cut you up!

:neutral:

[HybridIndian]

yeh it is haram 100% because your soul is still alive when your dead

so you will feel the pain if someone was to cut you up!

:neutral:
Is that supposed to be a joke?

[*1001Nights*]

wow.....im not sure i can find out later tho

[.Mazzy.]

It's perfectly fine to donate organs as long as you're not putting your own life in danger.

See "donating blood".

lol..

[P4ki4Lyf]

I thinkkk you're not allowed to donate organs, because they're not yours to give away..i remember reading that some where years ago, not sure if its true.

[noreenc]

i agree with Hybrid, i'm a donor and I don't see anything wrong with it. there's probably nothing greater than being able to save someone's life. then again, everyone has their own opinion on the issue. my dad didn't want me to be a donor but i always think what if it was someone in my family or my close friend that needed an organ or something...

[HybridIndian]

i agree with Hybrid, i'm a donor and I don't see anything wrong with it. there's probably nothing greater than being able to save someone's life. then again, everyone has their own opinion on the issue. my dad didn't want me to be a donor but i always think what if it was someone in my family or my close friend that needed an organ or something... Vaard!

I dont see why it would be condemned in the first place since it is for the betterment of humanity.

[ilyas@!!oops!!]

Is that supposed to be a joke?
nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

i know it's true u will feel pain! :neutral:

[NeRgYz]

yeh it is haram 100% because your soul is still alive when your dead

so you will feel the pain if someone was to cut you up!

:neutral:



yeaaa....that exactly what imam has told us.....

[Riddemz]

nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

i know it's true u will feel pain! :neutral:
hahaha
they dont keep you awake, or atleast they make sure you dont feel anything

[*1001Nights*]

i agree with Hybrid, i'm a donor and I don't see anything wrong with it. there's probably nothing greater than being able to save someone's life. then again, everyone has their own opinion on the issue. my dad didn't want me to be a donor but i always think what if it was someone in my family or my close friend that needed an organ or something...
but essentially it is up to Allah(swt) wheather they live or die and its Him tht would be saving their life so if its there time to go then yor organ may not evn matter

[*1001Nights*]

nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo

i know it's true u will feel pain! :neutral:
wtff....doesnt ur soul leave your body? :sarb:

[TheLoneAvenger]

http://www.islamonline.net/servlet/Satellite?cid=1119503543346&pagename=IslamOnline-English-Ask_Scholar/FatwaE/FatwaEAskTheScholar

I know, it's just an online source, but Dr. Muzammil Siddiqi is generally well regarded and offers pretty sound explanations.

[minty~ice~cold]

I think it's alright to donate your kidney and stuff, but not vital organs. I mean, you can live with one kidney right? But I don't think you can donate your heart or something like that. You're supposed to keep them cuz yeah, about the "amanat" thing. I'm not sure though.

[NeRgYz]

Vaard!

I dont see why it would be condemned in the first place since it is for the betterment of humanity.


i agree wit u....i really want to donate my organs but this Islamic lectures about organs donations scares me alot.....


yea, i m kinda religious

[ilyas@!!oops!!]

wtff....doesnt ur soul leave your body? :sarb:


yeh it does......but ur body is dead 100%

but the soul is alive for the angels and Allah to deal with!

:neutral: :(

[ilyas@!!oops!!]

yeaaa....that exactly what imam has told us.....


i know my death subject! :D :wavey:

[HybridIndian]

but essentially it is up to Allah(swt) wheather they live or die and its Him tht would be saving their life so if its there time to go then yor organ may not evn matter
I see what you're saying but thats like saying 'Whats the point of having doctors? If the person is supposed to live, he will. Its up to Allah (SWA) to decide'

That just doesnt sound right to me.

I think you should try to save a live but the ultimate decision is in Allah (SWA)'s hand. So either way, their destiny and time of death is predetermined, therefore, you're better off trying to save the life.

[*1001Nights*]

yeh it does......but ur body is dead 100%

but the soul is alive for the angels and Allah to deal with!

:neutral: :(
ok ur confuzzing me lol.............if your body is dead nd your soul is not there why would u feel pain?

[Riddemz]

but essentially it is up to Allah(swt) wheather they live or die and its Him tht would be saving their life so if its there time to go then yor organ may not evn matter
since your organs are not yours and gods, then you are giving gods creations to somebody else
and that is how he chooses to save the others... through you

[TheLoneAvenger]

but essentially it is up to Allah(swt) wheather they live or die and its Him tht would be saving their life so if its there time to go then yor organ may not evn matter

By that attitude, if I have a heart attack, I shouldn't seek treatment since it's God's will if I live or die.

[noreenc]

Vaard!

I dont see why it would be condemned in the first place since it is for the betterment of humanity.

exxxactly, you're saving someone's life....

but i know a guy that always says he would never be a donor if they need an organ or something. he said that apparently if the person was dying or something, its their time to go and nobody should interfere with that. they shouldnt give someone else's organs to a man/woman that is going to die because its all in god's hands.

[HybridIndian]

i agree wit u....i really want to donate my organs but this Islamic lectures about organs donations scares me alot.....


yea, i m kinda religious
I feel that if your intentions are good and you do do something wrong, I'm sure you'll be forgiven.

[*1001Nights*]

I see what you're saying but thats like saying 'Whats the point of having doctors? If the person is supposed to live, he will. Its up to Allah (SWA) to decide'

That just doesnt sound right to me.

I think you should try to save a live but the ultimate decision is in Allah (SWA)'s hand. So either way, their destiny and time of death is predetermined, therefore, you're better off trying to save the life.
yea i see wht ur saying i guess tht makes more sense

[desi_balla63]

www.Google.com

[Logical_Uzi]

Many Islamic scholars and Jurists have written on the subject of organ transplant. Over the decades, medicine has improved and advanced dramatically, taking medical technology to extreme heights.

Today, through the vast medical advancement, almost any transplant of the human body can be performed. Owing to the technological medical changes, prominent and renowned jurists of the world have carefully analysed the process of organ transplant and upon investigation made the following observations:

1. When any person's limb or organ becomes unusable and that limb or organ is needed to function in the future by a suitable replacement then the following conditions must be considered.

Use of a non-living component.

Use the limb of those animals permissible to eat and slaughtered according to the Islamic rites of slaughter.

There is almost certain fear of loss of life or danger of losing the limb/organ and the replacement is only found in Haraam animals or in permissible animals (which can be eaten) but not slaughtered according to Islamic rites, then use of such a component will be permissible. However, if there is no imminent danger of loss of life then it will not be permissible to use anything from the pig.

2. Similarly, a transplant of any nature whatsoever is permissible from one part to another part of the body of the same person when necessary.

3. The sale of any part of the human body is Haraam.

4. If any ill person reaches a stage that a specific organ becomes unusable (to such an extent) that if a human organ is not replaced into the body then there is an immediate danger of loss of life -- the human organ is the only suitable replacement and medical experts are absolutely certain that besides the human organ, there is no other life-saving substitute and the patients' life is in danger, and the human organ is easily available to the patient, then in that dire need a human organ transplant (to save one's life) will be permissible for the sick.

5. When a perfectly healthy person on the advice of an expert physician confirms that the removal of one kidney will not harm nor cause ill-health whatsoever and considering the deteriorating health of his sick immediate family member which may cause death and there is no other alternate or substitute then this will be permissible with the condition that the kidney be donated and not sold.

The bequest (Wasiyyat) of a person that after his death, his organs be donated is forbidden in Shariah.

[sara khan]

I havent read all your thread. BUT LISTEN TO ME! Because i investigated about this, since i myself want to donate organs. Being a doc i see too many lives go to waste because insecurity about this issue.

Donating organs in islam is allowed, as long as you DONT SELL your organs.

You can also decide what organs to donate, and which ones not too.

Allah (swt) knows if your intentions are good or not, and when you intend to help, donating your organs is considered as sawab.

[HybridIndian]

exxxactly, you're saving someone's life....

but i know a guy that always says he would never be a donor if they need an organ or something. he said that apparently if the person was dying or something, its their time to go and nobody should interfere with that. they shouldnt give someone else's organs to a man/woman that is going to die because its all in god's hands.First off, organ transplants are not always 100% successful. The body can reject the new organ. I see that as a sign from God as "Its his time, organ transplant isnt going to save his life."

Second, just by donating an organ you're not gauranteeing a saved life. It God has predetermined your time to die, no matter what you do, not matter how much money you spend, and no matter how advanced the technology is, it wont be able to save the life. Period!

[desi_balla63]

Many Islamic scholars and Jurists have written on the subject of organ transplant. Over the decades, medicine has improved and advanced dramatically, taking medical technology to extreme heights.

Today, through the vast medical advancement, almost any transplant of the human body can be performed. Owing to the technological medical changes, prominent and renowned jurists of the world have carefully analysed the process of organ transplant and upon investigation made the following observations:

1. When any person's limb or organ becomes unusable and that limb or organ is needed to function in the future by a suitable replacement then the following conditions must be considered.

Use of a non-living component.

Use the limb of those animals permissible to eat and slaughtered according to the Islamic rites of slaughter.

There is almost certain fear of loss of life or danger of losing the limb/organ and the replacement is only found in Haraam animals or in permissible animals (which can be eaten) but not slaughtered according to Islamic rites, then use of such a component will be permissible. However, if there is no imminent danger of loss of life then it will not be permissible to use anything from the pig.

2. Similarly, a transplant of any nature whatsoever is permissible from one part to another part of the body of the same person when necessary.

3. The sale of any part of the human body is Haraam.

4. If any ill person reaches a stage that a specific organ becomes unusable (to such an extent) that if a human organ is not replaced into the body then there is an immediate danger of loss of life -- the human organ is the only suitable replacement and medical experts are absolutely certain that besides the human organ, there is no other life-saving substitute and the patients' life is in danger, and the human organ is easily available to the patient, then in that dire need a human organ transplant (to save one's life) will be permissible for the sick.

5. When a perfectly healthy person on the advice of an expert physician confirms that the removal of one kidney will not harm nor cause ill-health whatsoever and considering the deteriorating health of his sick immediate family member which may cause death and there is no other alternate or substitute then this will be permissible with the condition that the kidney be donated and not sold.

The bequest (Wasiyyat) of a person that after his death, his organs be donated is forbidden in Shariah.
http://www.albalagh.net/qa/blood_transfusion_transplant.shtml

[sara khan]

I havent read all your thread. BUT LISTEN TO ME! Because i investigated about this, since i myself want to donate organs. Being a doc i see too many lives go to waste because insecurity about this issue.

Donating organs in islam is allowed, as long as you DONT SELL your organs.

You can also decide what organs to donate, and which ones not too.

Allah (swt) knows if your intentions are good or not, and when you intend to help, donating your organs is considered as sawab.
:yes:

[Charlatan]

so, we were having some discussions about organs donations and found out that there were only 3 donors in my class .....i wanted to b a donor too but i was said that its haram to donate your organs coz they are Allah's "amanat"....but isnt it sunnat to save someone's life??.....are u willing to donate ur organs too??

btw, if anyone of you take this as a joke, U R IN THE WRONG THREAD!!!!

arent you half bahai? just donate from your bahai side. :rolleyes:

[desi_balla63]

:yes:
:gtfo: with your "knowledge".

[Logical_Uzi]

desi_balla63, i used ask-imam its the same scholar.

[parkinlotpimp]

:yes:
:wavey:

[Gimmeck]

I thinkkk you're not allowed to donate organs, because they're not yours to give away..i remember reading that some where years ago, not sure if its true.
Hmmm
So if you can't remove them, what about if one of your organs go bad and doctors recommend that you have them removed?

[Kyleoberoi]

i suggest u donate ur organs before u die :)

i decided 2 donate my sex organs but da doc told me dat my cock is outta control n it wouldnt be a good idea 2 donate it. other organs arent fuctioning properly otherwise i would have donated those already.

[NeRgYz]

arent you half bahai? just donate from your bahai side. :rolleyes:

does the words "haram", "Allah" and "sunnat" sounds bahai to you???

[desi_balla63]

i suggest u donate ur organs before u die :)

i decided 2 donate my sex organs but da doc told me dat my cock is outta control n it wouldnt be a good idea 2 donate it. other organs arent fuctioning properly otherwise i would have donated those already.
I like the idea.

The delivery's a little poor, though. I would go with "but my main organ wouldn't fit in the bag :p".

[sara khan]

:gtfo: with your "knowledge".
http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y23/sarakhan/txtfo.gif

[desi_balla63]

Chit.

I totally just confused Nergyz with Sketchy.

[NeRgYz]

donating organs to non-muslims is definitely haraam.

how can it b haram for cadaver donors??....

[desi_balla63]

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y23/sarakhan/txtfo.gif
I'm talking to Sameer right now. He's banning that smiley.

[NeRgYz]

Chit.

I totally just confused Nergyz with Sketchy.

someone is missing Sketchy today.... :p

[TheLoneAvenger]

I havent read all your thread. BUT LISTEN TO ME! Because i investigated about this, since i myself want to donate organs. Being a doc i see too many lives go to waste because insecurity about this issue.


Do you actually practice?

[*1001Nights*]

my friend says "i mean islam says that we should preserve our bodies to near-perfect but saving a life is more important to me personally"

[sara khan]

:wavey:
hi deepak :wavey:

[desi_balla63]

someone is missing Sketchy today.... :p
:hand:

You both are similar looking. You both have boyfriends who are / were on RD. It's not my fault!

[Charlatan]

does the words "haram", "Allah" and "sunnat" sounds bahai to you???

http://forums.ratedesi.com/showpost.php?p=8114609&postcount=4
i m half baha'i....aid mubarak to u too.....

:dunno:

[Kyleoberoi]

donating organs to non-muslims is definitely haraam.
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl::ro fl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl::ro fl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl::ro fl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl::ro fl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl::ro fl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:



Dats da funniest shit ive heard bud. Izlamist god must be anti non-izlamists...eh?

[Kyleoberoi]

We're forbidden to attend funerals for dead non-muslims, and technically, to even keep non-muslims as friends, so how can it be halaal to donate organs to save the life of a disbeliever?
u cant be friends wid non muslims. iz dat right? den how wuld u convert dem?

[sara khan]

I'm talking to Sameer right now. He's banning that smiley.
its my own smily. Its not bannable :hand:

[Spiky]

donating organs to non-muslims is definitely haraam.


QFT.

Donating organs itself is haram. Its GOD's body. Not to mention donating it to a non-believer. That's super haram. Also all that shit which Logical_Uzi posted in the hierarchical order of events to happen before you donate is also some imams personal views and dont reflect Qurans path. Ask Khanbaba_ for further info.

Muslims have every right to be selfish hypocrites in the present world and not to save any lives, for we are the chosen people and infidels need to rot on earth and hell.

AMEN!

[sara khan]

Do you actually practice?
practice what?

[desi_balla63]

its my own smily. Its not bannable :hand:
That's what you said about your mainsite account. :hand:

[desi_balla63]

practice what?
:bball:

[TheLoneAvenger]

practice what?

Medicine. You said you were a physician. Just curious.

[Kyleoberoi]

my friend says "i mean islam says that we should preserve our bodies to near-perfect but saving a life is more important to me personally"
how do u preserve ur body 2 near perfect?

[SarcasmicBengali]

what do you think is right and wrong in this situation?
do you think its wrong to save someones life even if you stay alive at it?
if so then dont do it

if you think its right then do it
dont you think god prefers you saving someone else instead of following those rules?

hell even if it were a sin, and even if what you believed in was true, even if there was such a thing as heaven and hell
god would still know that you did it in good intentions and so there wouldnt be anything wrong with it

punishing you for a good intention would be rather evil... and im hoping that you dont think that god is evil

thats a whole load of good sence...
unfortunately, most desies of any religion never try to follow their conscience and rely on their own common sence to distinguish between right and wrong...
but rather excrutiatingly consider everything religious rule/law, even if it contradicts what they know to be right...

[sara khan]

That's what you said about your mainsite account. :hand:
:squint:

jo bhi :hand:

[.Mazzy.]

I think it's alright to donate your kidney and stuff, but not vital organs. I mean, you can live with one kidney right? But I don't think you can donate your heart or something like that. You're supposed to keep them cuz yeah, about the "amanat" thing. I'm not sure though.
Like I said. . .
It's perfectly fine to donate organs as long as you're not putting your own life in danger.

See "donating blood".

lol..


I'm sooo religious. :D

[sara khan]

Medicine. You said you were a physician. Just curious.
I am a MBBS, i have a year left on my MD degree. Yes, i practice as a MBBS.

[SarcasmicBengali]

but essentially it is up to Allah(swt) wheather they live or die and its Him tht would be saving their life so if its there time to go then yor organ may not evn matter

but on the same logic... if i donate my organ and it ends up possibly saving someone... that too is because Allah(swt) allowed that person to live right...?

so... even if i became a doner on my own its probably Allah's(swt) doing as well...? :sarb:

[Riddemz]

thats a whole load of good sence...
unfortunately, most desies of any religion never try to follow their conscience and rely on their own common sence to distinguish between right and wrong...
but rather excrutiatingly consider everything religious rule/law, even if it contradicts what they know to be right...
sadly...
hopefully one day people will learn to think for themselves
and this doesnt mean that they have to stop believing in their religions, but atleast they wouldnt blindly be following something

[Kyleoberoi]

:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: WERD :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: WERD :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: WERD :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: WERD :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: WERD :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: WERD :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: WERD :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: WERD :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: WERD :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: WERD :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:
:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: WERD :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl:

[*BabyGirl*]

donating organs to non-muslims is definitely haraam.

oh pls! :hand: When it comes to saving someone's life, it doesn't matter what religion you are, so stop assuming things.

:no: Oh my days......

[TheLoneAvenger]

I am a MBBS, i have a year left on my MD degree. Yes, i practice as a MBBS.

I see. A foreign grad then.

[Riddemz]

but on the same logic... if i donate my organ and it ends up possibly saving someone... that too is because Allah(swt) allowed that person to live right...?

so... even if i became a doner on my own its probably Allah's(swt) doing as well...? :sarb:
according to their logic this is true :)

[NeRgYz]

:hand:

You both are similar looking. You both have boyfriends who are / were on RD. It's not my fault!

lolll....my ex boyfriend (now my fianc) were NEVER on RD....in fact, he hated RD alot.....and i kno its not ur fault.....:bhapi:

[Riddemz]

muslims dont make muslims. Allah(swt) makes muslims.
so are you saying that allah is a racist? since he chose to leave out people that live north of the middle east?
god also wants to send all of latin america to hell?

[NeRgYz]

http://forums.ratedesi.com/showpost.php?p=8114609&postcount=4


:dunno:


:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: .....it was a JOKE.....i cant believe somebody actually remembered this.....thats so cute!!!

[sara khan]

I see. A foreign grad then.
Depends what you mean by "foreign". I live and study in Europe, studying in the 6 year med programme.

[spice_of_life]

I personally dont think its haraam unless u actually donate ur organ for the intention to die...

but if ur donating ur organ after ur death i dont think its haraam.

Eitherway i wanted to donate my organ as well and about to sign the consent form but my parents didnt allow me to do so...Reason they gave me was people who need the organ badly wud kill me! Which i thot was stupid but well....they dont let me donate so there...

Anyways in Islamic point of view...u can go read this for more info ....
http://www.islamqa.com/index.php?ref=49711&ln=eng&txt=organ%20donation

[*BabyGirl*]

The thread-starter asked a question, and I answered her.

Your personal feelings about the issue are irrelevant.


That isn't me stating my personal views. It is you.

When it comes to saving someone's life, regardless of what colour, ethnicity, religion etc they belong to, as a Muslim it's your duty to help them if it is in your power to do so. Charity is one of the pillars of Islam. Charity is not only given to other Muslims, but all people less fortunate than yourself. ***

[Kyleoberoi]

Quite simply: Yes.

My God doesn't love those who don't believe in him. All that "god loves everybody" is christian nonsense, even the bible testifies against that kind of logic.
I know a izlamist friend who says watever he has asked his god has been fullfilled. I got christian homies dat claim their god has always been there for them whenever they were in need. Ma hindu mates [including myself] claim their god has never turned them down. god loves every one otherwise every single izlamist would be on top n every single non izlamist would be at da bottom of the barrel which m afriad is not the case. ur doctrine is messed up. fuck dat

[NeRgYz]

I personally dont think its haraam unless u actually donate ur organ for the intention to die...

but if ur donating ur organ after ur death i dont think its haraam.

Eitherway i wanted to donate my organ as well and about to sign the consent form but my parents didnt allow me to do so...Reason they gave me was people who need the organ badly wud kill me! Which i thot was stupid but well....they dont let me donate so there...

Anyways in Islamic point of view...u can go read this for more info ....
http://www.islamqa.com/index.php?ref=49711&ln=eng&txt=organ%20donation



:rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: :rofl: .....

[Kyleoberoi]

Through practice and example.

Muslims dont "convert" anybody because there is no compulsion in religion. Allah(swt) guides whomever he wills.

muslims dont make muslims. Allah(swt) makes muslims.
ur reasoning abiilities/capabilites r messed up.

[Riddemz]

What are you talking about, who said anything about race?

Allah(swt) states plainly in the Qur'aan that he chose to reveal his message in ARABIC, does this mean that non-arabs are exluded from his message? No, it simply means that he chose that part of the world for his final revelation to take mount, and from there it has spread across all 4 corners of the earth.

Most Arabs today are Muslim, but most Muslims today are NOT ARAB. So where exactly are you trying to go with this?
you said that allah chooses who is muslim and who is not

[Space-Cowboy]

We're forbidden to attend funerals for dead non-muslims, and technically, to even keep non-muslims as friends, so how can it be halaal to donate organs to save the life of a disbeliever?


awwwww can you feel the love? :grouphug:

[Kyleoberoi]

What are you talking about, who said anything about race?

Allah(swt) states plainly in the Qur'aan that he chose to reveal his message in ARABIC, does this mean that non-arabs are exluded from his message? No, it simply means that he chose that part of the world for his final revelation to take mount, and from there it has spread across all 4 corners of the earth.

Most Arabs today are Muslim, but most Muslims today are NOT ARAB. So where exactly are you trying to go with this?
:rofl: @ allah chose 2 reveal his message in arabic. :rofl: dats only coz da messenger was jordinian or sumething. iz dat right? :rofl:

[Space-Cowboy]

How is it me?

Sura (5:51) - "O you who believe! do not take the Jews and the Christians for friends; they are friends of each other; and whoever amongst you takes them for a friend, then surely he is one of them; surely Allah does not guide the unjust people."

Sura (5:80) - "You will see many of them befriending those who disbelieve; certainly evil is that which their souls have sent before for them, that Allah became displeased with them and in chastisement shall they abide."

Sura (3:28) - "Let not the believers Take for friends or helpers Unbelievers rather than believers: if any do that, in nothing will there be help from Allah..."

Sura (3:118) - "O you who believe! do not take for intimate friends from among others than your own people..."

Sura (9:23) - "O ye who believe! Choose not your fathers nor your brethren for friends if they take pleasure in disbelief rather than faith. Whoso of you taketh them for friends, such are wrong-doers"

Listen, it aint like if I see a nun about to get hit by a truck, I'm not going to warn her, or even pull her out of the way, of course I would...but as far as going OUT OF MY WAY to help a non-muslim, especially when there are so many MUSLIMS today are in dire need of help, you can forget it.

Allah(swt) made us an UMMAH for a REASON. Please educate yourself about the deen before you speak on it.


^^^And people wonder what harm religion can do.

[Kyleoberoi]

How is it me?

Sura (5:51) - "O you who believe! do not take the Jews and the Christians for friends; they are friends of each other; and whoever amongst you takes them for a friend, then surely he is one of them; surely Allah does not guide the unjust people."

Sura (5:80) - "You will see many of them befriending those who disbelieve; certainly evil is that which their souls have sent before for them, that Allah became displeased with them and in chastisement shall they abide."

Sura (3:28) - "Let not the believers Take for friends or helpers Unbelievers rather than believers: if any do that, in nothing will there be help from Allah..."

Sura (3:118) - "O you who believe! do not take for intimate friends from among others than your own people..."

Sura (9:23) - "O ye who believe! Choose not your fathers nor your brethren for friends if they take pleasure in disbelief rather than faith. Whoso of you taketh them for friends, such are wrong-doers"

Listen, it aint like if I see a nun about to get hit by a truck, I'm not going to warn her, or even pull her out of the way, of course I would...but as far as going OUT OF MY WAY to help a non-muslim, especially when there are so many MUSLIMS today are in dire need of help, you can forget it.

Allah(swt) made us an UMMAH for a REASON. Please educate yourself about the deen before you speak on it.

iz dat right?

u make ur beliefs look fucked up mate.

:toast::toast::toast::toast::toast::toast::toast:: toast::toast::toast::toast:

[desi_shawrty]

I don't think it's haram to donate your organs.

I would do it too, and in quran it does say that you ccan do what ever to save another person's or your own life.

[Kyleoberoi]

my dude, you can believe whatever you want to. Allah(swt) revealed the truth for us to follow in his book in clear and simple language.

As a muslim, to take away or add to that is a great sin, and that is what dissolves emaan.

To sin is one thing, to try to justify falsehoods by assuming that you know better than your creator is something entirely different.
u fucktard, u arnt even answering my questions. if izlamist faith was da only true faith then we non izlamists would be at the bottom of da barrel coz u said god has cursed all non izlamists.... u cant befriend non izlamists, donate organs or help them out. wat da fuck r u tryna imply , mate?

[Kyleoberoi]

U aint even muslim, so why are you even involved in this discussion?
m involved in this discussion coz this discussion is about non izlamists. dats simple logic i guess.

[desi_shawrty]

Please provide PROOF of your claims, in context of the discussion at hand.
eh that's going to take for ever. I read it in the translation of the quran in english. I don't remember where it is exactly though.

[Kyleoberoi]

Oh really.

So you're telling me that you would go out of your way to help a stranger before you would help someone in your own family? Is that right?
depends on the situation. if u r in a situation where u have 2 choose between ur family n a helpless pedestrian then yes... family comes first, but if u see a helpless non izlamist n u do nothing for him is like killing all humanity. i would go out of my way 2 help a human being regardsless of his/her faith coz dats wat we have been taught in our faith.


fuck that

[NeRgYz]

people!!!....this Topic Only About Organs Donations....not About Who Is Muslim And Who Is Not!!!!.....make Ur Own Thread If U Want To Discuss That

[Space-Cowboy]

Oh really.

So you're telling me that you would go out of your way to help a stranger before you would help someone in your own family? Is that right?


Quit creating a straw man, that's not what I was arguing at all.


Religion divides, and your posts just go to prove it dead on.

The fact that you're willing to consider the world body of Muslims your 'family' and shut the rest out just goes to prove it.

[*BabyGirl*]

How is it me?

Sura (5:51) - "O you who believe! do not take the Jews and the Christians for friends; they are friends of each other; and whoever amongst you takes them for a friend, then surely he is one of them; surely Allah does not guide the unjust people."

Sura (5:80) - "You will see many of them befriending those who disbelieve; certainly evil is that which their souls have sent before for them, that Allah became displeased with them and in chastisement shall they abide."

Sura (3:28) - "Let not the believers Take for friends or helpers Unbelievers rather than believers: if any do that, in nothing will there be help from Allah..."

Sura (3:118) - "O you who believe! do not take for intimate friends from among others than your own people..."

Sura (9:23) - "O ye who believe! Choose not your fathers nor your brethren for friends if they take pleasure in disbelief rather than faith. Whoso of you taketh them for friends, such are wrong-doers"

Listen, it aint like if I see a nun about to get hit by a truck, I'm not going to warn her, or even pull her out of the way, of course I would...but as far as going OUT OF MY WAY to help a non-muslim, especially when there are so many MUSLIMS today are in dire need of help, you can forget it.

Allah(swt) made us an UMMAH for a REASON. Please educate yourself about the deen before you speak on it.


Okay but being friends and giving charity is two different things. You are helping someone in need. For example as a kid your parents might not want you to mix with certain kids as they may have a bad influence on you. But that doesn't mean you hate on them or avoid helping them if they need you. That makes you a worse off person. I think your being selective in your choice of facts and rather narrow minded.

[Kyleoberoi]

listen fam, why should I even dignify you with a response when you refer to us as "islamizists" instead of MUSLIMS. That is insulting. secondly even if I were to sit here until 10 pm breaking the deen down to you, it still wouldn't make a difference, you have a seal on your heart, and a seal on your hearing.

but to answer your question, Allah(swt) states in the Qur'aan that he gives the unbelievers the pleasures of this world, which is temporary, while he reserves the pleasures of the hereafter, which is eternal, for those who believe in him and all that was revealed through his messenger(saw).

therein lies the difference.
fuck dat... m not implying every single non izlamist is living da American dream.. there r lots of non muzlims dat r suffering. by ur logic... every single non muzlim is living da perfect life coz "god has given the unbelievers the pleasures of the world, which is temporary". Fuck dat mate. wat has god revealed concerning those non muzlims dat r suffering just like many muslims?

[*BabyGirl*]

If you agree that FAMILY COMES FIRST, then you've PROVEN MY POINT.

The premise of argument is simple: for a muslim to donate organs to a NON-MUSLIM with the intent to save his/her life when there are MUSLIMS in places like Palestine who would benefit from that kind of gesture is INDEED HARAAM.

Are you following? This is a question about priorities, not kind-heartedness.

I agree with that. But you can't overall conclude that donating to non-muslims is haraam. It clearly is not.

[Sketchy]

:hand:

You both are similar looking. You both have boyfriends who are / were on RD. It's not my fault!
Aww you missing the sketchy etchy.

[Kyleoberoi]

If you agree that FAMILY COMES FIRST, then you've PROVEN MY POINT.

The premise of argument is simple: for a muslim to donate organs to a NON-MUSLIM with the intent to save his/her life when there are MUSLIMS in places like Palestine who would benefit from that kind of gesture is INDEED HARAAM.

Are you following? This is a question about priorities, not kind-heartedness.
u dont make much sense. palestinian cause is irrelevent if u were in a situation where u had a izlamist on one hand n a non izlamist on the other... n u had 2 choose between da two.. choosing ur izlamist brotha would be understandable in dat case but ur simplying implying dat u shouldnt help a non izlamist cos dats just haraam. u must be schizophrenic

[desi_balla63]

Aww you missing the sketchy etchy.

:Pissed:

[Kyleoberoi]

Hey sugarside, m very open n my heart is not sealed. its not original ... came wid a broken seal. carry on bud.

[*BabyGirl*]

First of all, I just quoted Allah(swt) himself from what he said in HIS BOOK, so this debate is actually over.

but again, this is about PRIORITIES. as Muslims, our priorities should deal with MUSLIMS first and foremost. Why is that so hard to comprehend?

I dont think you're familiar with the idea of Zakaat. It goes much deeper than simple "charity," and I dont think you understand that. Please stop trying to define Islaamic terms with western ideas, because it doesn't work, and you end up looking stupid in the process.

For every NON MUSLIM IN NEED, there are tens, hundreds, thousands, millions of MUSLIMS IN NEED. That being said, I'm looking after my OWN, as all muslims SHOULD.

I didn't say the quotes were wrong. I'm just saying you misinterpreted them to a certain extent. I agree that priorities lie with family. Help your own before others. But you said donating to non-muslims is Haraam. So really I don't think you personally understand what you mean when you talk about priorities. It doesn't mean that helping non-muslims is haraam. That's just you being ignorant. Our prophet had non-muslim teachers, neighbours etc whom they respected, were there for at times of ill health so, No it's not haraam to donate to non-muslims, providing family comes first.

[Sketchy]

:Pissed:
don't be such a piss-eater about it.

[Kyleoberoi]

I didn't say the quotes were wrong. I'm just saying you misinterpreted them to a certain extent. I agree that priorities lie with family. Help your own before others. But you said donating to non-muslims is Haraam. So really I don't think you personally understand what you mean when you talk about priorities. It doesn't mean that helping non-muslims is haraam. That's just you being ignorant. Our prophet had non-muslim teachers, neighbours etc whom they respected, were there for at times of ill health so, No it's not haraam to donate to non-muslims, providing family comes first.
ur good at sugarcoating da true beliefs :)

Yep... da wacko is outta his god damn mind.

[sara khan]

people!!!....this Topic Only About Organs Donations....not About Who Is Muslim And Who Is Not!!!!.....make Ur Own Thread If U Want To Discuss That
:p

These ppl dont understand the words coming out of your mouth

[chris tucker\]

[*BabyGirl*]

ur good at sugarcoating da true beliefs :)

Yep... da wacko is outta his god damn mind.

lol I'm not sugar coating ...

People are selective. It all depends on how you interpret things. One can read a sentence and conclude different meanings from it and it's your choice what you want to beleive as it is with this case. = )

[Kyleoberoi]

I'm not saying that its wrong to help non-muslims, I'm saying that it's wrong to go out of your way to help them when there are so many MUSLIMS who need help, and on a much greater scale.
is dat right?

Then wat da fock iz this:




Sura (5:51) - "O you who believe! do not take the Jews and the Christians for friends; they are friends of each other; and whoever amongst you takes them for a friend, then surely he is one of them; surely Allah does not guide the unjust people."

Sura (5:80) - "You will see many of them befriending those who disbelieve; certainly evil is that which their souls have sent before for them, that Allah became displeased with them and in chastisement shall they abide."

Sura (3:28) - "Let not the believers Take for friends or helpers Unbelievers rather than believers: if any do that, in nothing will there be help from Allah..."

Sura (3:118) - "O you who believe! do not take for intimate friends from among others than your own people..."

Sura (9:23) - "O ye who believe! Choose not your fathers nor your brethren for friends if they take pleasure in disbelief rather than faith. Whoso of you taketh them for friends, such are wrong-doers".


Nice try, mate.

ur confused. yes.. u should go outta ur way when dat wacko izlamist homie iz lying in dat pool of blood in dire need of help but, when u see a non izlamist u wouldnt bother helping out coz ur heading home 2 eat ur shit n watch tele. helping him out fits in "going out of ur way" category. is dat right?

[desi_shawrty]

you dont remember it because it doesn't exist.
LOL no

I have read the whole quran and I don't remember where any of that is at all. I just read it, not memorize what part everything is in.

[Kyleoberoi]

Honestly this is all pretty fucking retarded.

If the Prophet(saw) forbade us from even MIGRATING TO NON-MUSLIM COUNTRIES, and living amongst the kufar, then how the FUCK can it be permissble to "help" the kufar?

what version of Islaam are y'all practicing?
fuck me... god forbade u 2 live amongst non muslims. is dat right? mashallah...wat a loving god u got, mate.

[Kyleoberoi]

Fags like you just ruin it for the rest of us. Seriously. Stop.
ur brotha is quoting verse after verse from ur holy book 2 prove his point. no need 2 insult him. if u dont have anything 2 counter his arguments den kindly shut da fock up. :)

[NeRgYz]

:p

These ppl dont understand the words coming out of your mouth

[chris tucker\]


i knoo....thats why i m out of this thread.....

[TheLoneAvenger]

Honestly this is all pretty fucking retarded.

If the Prophet(saw) forbade us from even MIGRATING TO NON-MUSLIM COUNTRIES, and living amongst the kufar, then how the FUCK can it be permissble to "help" the kufar?

what version of Islaam are y'all practicing?



Geez. Yes, Islam preaches helping Muslims. Yes, Zakat is meant for Muslims. But that doesn't mean we can't offer additional charity to non-Muslims who mean no harm to the Muslim community.

I've been to countless Jumaas where the khutba focused on being good to our NON-Muslim neighbors and how it is required of us as Muslims to treat them with dignity/respect and help them in their time of need as well.

(Show) kindness unto parents, and unto near kindred, and orphans, and the needy, and into the neighbor who is of kin (unto you) and the neighbor who is not of kin and the fellow traveler…) (An-Nisaa’ 4:34 )

http://www.islamonline.net/English/introducingislam/society/Neighborhoods/article02.shtml

So yes, we should be helping Muslims, I'm not disagreeing with you, but thinking that it's haram to help non-Muslims, realizing that acts of charity/kindness Muslims only helps create a better image of Islam in a western society and can be considered dawah.

A hadith:
Volume 8, Book 73, Number 158:

Narrated Abu Huraira:

The Prophet said, "Whoever believes in Allah and the Last Day, should not hurt his neighbor and whoever believes in Allah and the Last Day, should serve his guest generously and whoever believes in Allah and the Last Day, should talk what is good or keep quiet."
---------------------------------------------------------

Besides, it's fairly well known that during the early time of Islam, the Prophet Muhammed (pbuh) sought refuge in Abyssinia which was ruled by a Christian king.

[soladylike]

How is it me?

Sura (5:51) - "O you who believe! do not take the Jews and the Christians for friends; they are friends of each other; and whoever amongst you takes them for a friend, then surely he is one of them; surely Allah does not guide the unjust people."

Sura (5:80) - "You will see many of them befriending those who disbelieve; certainly evil is that which their souls have sent before for them, that Allah became displeased with them and in chastisement shall they abide."

Sura (3:28) - "Let not the believers Take for friends or helpers Unbelievers rather than believers: if any do that, in nothing will there be help from Allah..."

Sura (3:118) - "O you who believe! do not take for intimate friends from among others than your own people..."

Sura (9:23) - "O ye who believe! Choose not your fathers nor your brethren for friends if they take pleasure in disbelief rather than faith. Whoso of you taketh them for friends, such are wrong-doers"

Listen, it aint like if I see a nun about to get hit by a truck, I'm not going to warn her, or even pull her out of the way, of course I would...but as far as going OUT OF MY WAY to help a non-muslim, especially when there are so many MUSLIMS today are in dire need of help, you can forget it.

Allah(swt) made us an UMMAH for a REASON. Please educate yourself about the deen before you speak on it.

Might want to take your own advice and read up on the tafseer/ commentary of the Quranic verses you quoted. And look at the time periods of when Surah Al-Maidah, Surah Al-I-Imran (from which you only quoted half a verse) and Surah At-Taubah.
Being an Ummah doesn't mean we're some tribe or an elitist club.

Religion wasn't meant to divide. It was meant to guide.

If Allah SWT provides for Muslims and non Muslims alike then who are you to say that non Muslims don't deserve kindness?

[Kyleoberoi]

lol I'm not sugar coating ...

People are selective. It all depends on how you interpret things. One can read a sentence and conclude different meanings from it and it's your choice what you want to beleive as it is with this case. = )
true said.. mista bin laden concludes dat all of us non izlamists should be destroyed. sugarside believes u shouldnt go outta ur way 2 help us non izlamists.

personal question... if u ever saw me lyin helpless, would u just pass by wid out helpin me out..eh? can u be heartless? fuck me hard.

[desi_shawrty]

We're suppose to spread Islam and how are we going to do that if we don't talk to non muslims.



The prophet Muhamad use to associate with non-muslims and help them all the time.

[Space-Cowboy]

Religion was meant to divide, and I'm all for it.

I'm not like you, I dont walk around singing "we are the world" to people who could care less about me.

sir, I am a muslim. You aren't, which is fine, but please do not try and tell me how to follow my religion, or what my religion teaches when you have no idea what you're talking about. If you are going to belittle what I've said in this thread, then you're actually belittling every muslim on these forums, whether they know it or not.

The fact that I'm willing to consider the world body of muslims as my family proves nothing else other than MY LOVE FOR MY PEOPLE.

Period.

Hmm... I may not be Muslim, but I'm pretty sure, THIS isn't how you're supposed to follow your religion either:

discuss yours. mianly for the fellas, that is if y'all even get down, a lotta y'all seem like lames...

Lead = New Chick


Sale = Chick you hit


On an average week I average between 7 and 25 leads, 40% coming from the internet, 40% from Night Life (Clubs, Lounges, Bars etc....) and 20% coming from women I met at or near work.

For arguments sake lets say I get 16 leads a week. I have a 30% conversion rate which means 30% of all leads turn into sales (Could be more but you have to figure time constraints , chicks who hold out etc....).

Lets break the 16 leads down by demographics...

7 Internet Chicks
6 Club/Lounge/Bar Chicks
3 Work Chicks

Now lets apply the conversion rate to the total number of chicks..

Number of conversions = 4.8 per week

4.8 x 52 weeks = 250

Five years at this rate = 1,250

Ten years = 2,500

stats are fun.


http://forums.ratedesi.com/showthread.php?t=220401

[TheLoneAvenger]

Hmm... I may not be Muslim, but I'm pretty sure, THIS isn't how you're supposed to follow your religion either:




http://forums.ratedesi.com/showthread.php?t=220401

Hah. I was kind of confused by this guys posting based on the thread you just linked.

It's a weird contrast.

[soladylike]

Hmm... I may not be Muslim, but I'm pretty sure, THIS isn't how you're supposed to follow your religion either:




http://forums.ratedesi.com/showthread.php?t=220401

hahahahaha
:Owned:

[Spiky]

If the Prophet(saw) forbade us from even MIGRATING TO NON-MUSLIM COUNTRIES, and living amongst the kufar, then how the FUCK can it be permissble to "help" the kufar?




ISLAM----The Religion of Peace!!!!1


LMAO. :rofl:

[*BabyGirl*]

There's nothing to misinterpret...what part of "do not take unbelievers as friends" DO YOU NOT UNDERSTAND?

and what part of giving charity does not mean you have to be a friend- do you not understand?


Who taught you your deen?

How can donating organs to NON-MUSLIMS, people who DENY the truth revealed to our messenger, be PERMISSIBLE, when there are MUSLIMS SUFFERING ALL OVER THIS PLANET?

yes thats where priorities come in. It however does not mean that donating organs to non-muslims is overall haraam.

How can I, as a muslim, feel satisfied with "helping" some kaffir in such a way when MY PEOPLE are in MUCH WORSE condition.

You see, THIS IS WHY muslims are so weak in this day and age, because people like you will bend and twist Islaam to suit your own agendas, and to make us seem "moderate" in the eyes of the west.

and you stated that our prophet(saw) had "non-muslim" teachers which is complete nonsense. Our prophet(saw) had only 1 teacher, and that teacher was Allah(swt), the originator of the heavens and the earth, lord of all the worlds. Period.

Yes our prophet (pbuh) had no teachers, However there was once a non-muslim who was questioned by our prophet.When he died, as his body was being carried away, our prophet stood up. The people asked our prophet why he did so and they answered that the man had taught him something he did not know hence for respect they did so.
I'm not sure of details. You should read it up.

[foreverconfused]

:drama:

[Kyleoberoi]

LOL it's quite simple you simple minded simpleton, here let me illustrate:

Say I'm walking home from the corner store.

I see a jewish lady become a victim of a hit and run.

of course I'm going to help her out, call an ambulance, so she can get some help.

that's common, human courtesy.

NOW, as far as cutting my fucking body open and donating something to a cause that has nothing to do with helping MY PEOPLE, then that is emphatically NOT GOING TO HAPPEN. Why is this considered so "vile" and evil" to y'all?
fuck dat.

cutting ur fuckin body open, after ur dead, 2 help non izlamist is called "goin out of ur way". ic...didnt know dat.

if a white man says u should only help whites, he is known as a racist.u believe in helping only ur izlamist ppl. do u consider urself 2 be a racist fucktard?

[foreverconfused]

discrimination on the basis of religion... how unethical.

[Kyleoberoi]

We're suppose to spread Islam and how are we going to do that if we don't talk to non muslims.



The prophet Muhamad use to associate with non-muslims and help them all the time.
i heard ur only allowed 2 spread izlam in bed wid a non izlamist. iz dat right?

[Space-Cowboy]

Hah. I was kind of confused by this guys posting based on the thread you just linked.

It's a weird contrast.



:dunno: I'm all for people having spirituality [personal spirituality]... I think spirituality can help promote union instead of division...



I think Atheism does just as good a job of promoting union too, but that's a different thread, different topic all together :p

[Kyleoberoi]

Kangana Ranaut :cheers:
Kangna iz my wifey

:naughty:

[*BabyGirl*]

i heard ur only allowed 2 spread izlam in bed wid a non izlamist. iz dat right?

Uncalled for.
It's annoying if someone keeps saying hendu (hindu) huna? Like wise. It's not Izlamists or Izlam. It is Islam. :) :)

[soladylike]

The fact that you're sinning and owning up to it so proudly doesn't mean you got a strong imaan.
Whatever dude.
:arrow:

[TheLoneAvenger]

:dunno: I'm all for people having spirituality [personal spirituality]... I think spirituality can help promote union instead of division...


I just don't feel comfortable with some of the rhetoric this guy is spouting off which directly conflicts with things I have heard/read from various sources and the fact that people here are taking his ramblings as fact for Islam.

I mean his whole thing on being forbidden from attending a non-Muslim's funeral directly contradicts what ISNA says. Everything that I have heard has stated that it is lawful as long as one does not participate in another religious custom.
http://www.isna.net/services/casc/questions.html

He's just being extremely inflammatory for no real reason.

[Spiky]

discrimination on the basis of religion... how unethical.


Except when it comes down to Islam. And people fucking whine that I am a crybaby who calls that religion as intolerant when there is abundance of retards like them they personally witness but cant say anything coz he is one of their own. :rofl:

[Space-Cowboy]

hahahahaha, i was waaaiiiiittttttiiinngggg for this, seriously.

on some real shit, real talk.

I will be the first person to tell you that I aint no righteouss motherfucker, I SIN.

I SIN

A LOT.

A WHOLE FUCKIN LOT.

I smoke weed, I fuck bitches, I do the damn thing homey, it's really nothin...

BUT

the difference is I can ACKNOWLEDGE the fact that I sin, and when I do sin, I DONT TRY TO EXCUSE THEM, I ask Allah(swt) to forgive me because he is the ONLY ONE WITH THE AUTHORITY TO FORGIVE ME FOR MY SINS, I don't have to put a front like I'm some ultra-righteous cat on here. For who? Y'ALL????? HEEELLLLLLLL FUCKIN' NO.

I said earlier in this thread that it's one thing to sin, but to deny your sins and to try and excuse them is another thing entirely.

The difference between me and other muslims on this board is that I KNOW MY RELIGION. I know what's right, and what's wrong, and when I do something wrong, I dont get on some "oh but I can do this because...." na...it doesn't work that way. I never said I was an imaam, or a shaykh. I never, ever claimed that title...and even shaykhs aren't excluded from sinning. I'm just a ***** who believes in his LORD, straight up.

On the day of judgement, Allah(swt) isn't going to question me as to what YOU thought about my actions, because we are all individuals. As long as my emaan is strong, and my aquid' is ON POINT, then I fast and pray that Allah(swt) will shower me with his mercy, because again, his will is the only will that matters.

THAT BEING SAID, you bringing that shit up proves that I've won this debate, seriously. Is that how we doing things now? Fuck outta here *****, dont pull bitch moves if you can't handle your own...

So, basically, what you're saying is, you're butt-hurt that everyone proved your wrong, and showed you just how fucking hypocritical you are.

You don't follow your own religion, you should be the last one to preach about it. :arrow:

[*BabyGirl*]

Space-Cowboy say something :squint:

*places my bet on You*

[Spiky]

Islaam isn't the religion of peace.

Islaam can't be defined by 1 thing or another, Islaam is the way of life perscribed for humanity by the creator of all thats in existence.

Muslims saying Islaam means peace are just as misguided as christians who say shit like "God is love"


Whatever dude...You personify the exact image of a fucking extremist/terrorist which I potray on RD. so fuck the rest of your crew coz you and khanbaba are a fucking living example of the shitheads which I talk of.

[soladylike]

Except when it comes down to Islam. And people fucking whine that I am a crybaby who calls that religion as intolerant when there is abundance of retards like them they personally witness but cant say anything coz he is one of their own. :rofl:

Uhh...did you not see the other Muslims contradicting him? Or is your perspective THAT biased?
We have our retards but we can't be mean to them.
It's haraam to be mean to someone who rides the short bus to school.

[Kyleoberoi]

no, god forbade us to take non-muslims as protectors, and to reside in their lands.

If the prayer is established in a land, the adhan is called, and the name of Allah(swt) is held high above everything else, then that is a land of Islaam. For a muslim to LEAVE THAT LAND and migrate to a disbelieving country, such as the United States for the sake of monetary gain, then that is a GREAT SIN.

It's about staying true to your OWN. L-O-Y-A-L-T-Y. Something some of y'all know nothing about.
ur a true izlamist. where do u live?

unlike u, m loyal 2 HUMANITY. i would go outta my way to help da cause of humanity. :)

[Space-Cowboy]

I just don't feel comfortable with some of the rhetoric this guy is spouting off which directly conflicts with things I have heard/read from various sources and the fact that people here are taking his ramblings as fact for Islam.

I mean his whole thing on being forbidden from attending a non-Muslim's funeral directly contradicts what ISNA says. Everything that I have heard has stated that it is lawful as long as one does not participate in another religious custom.
http://www.isna.net/services/casc/questions.html

He's just being extremely inflammatory for no real reason.


Oh, I agree with you. I can't stand the 'us v.s. they' mentality in ANY form, in any circumstance. Whether it be religion, or ethnicity, or language, or culture, etc.

In fact, I'll tell you something, about 'ethnicity'; it is for this reason that I can actually understand why so many Persians today felt utterly insulted by the movie 300, no? :dunno:

[Space-Cowboy]

Space-Cowboy say something :squint:

*places my bet on You*


Don't gamble.
It's a sin.

:Paper:

[soladylike]

Do you know the definition of emaan?

Again, this is a mute issue because the sins thay I, or any mother muslim commits on a day to day basis has no bearing on what we're talking about now.

We are discussing things related SPECIFICALLY to the tenets of Islaam.

If a so-called "righteouss" person claims that 1+1 = 3, and a crackhead states that 1+1 = 2, the crackhead is right regardless of the formers "merits."

y'all cant fuck with me, seriously...why can't y'all just SUBMIT TO THE TRUTH?

I'm sorry. I have trouble taking imaan advice from someone smokes weed and disrespects women by calling them "bitches" and being proud of the fact that he "fucks bitches".

I hear Al-Qaeda is recruiting again. Get in line. First come first serve.

[Space-Cowboy]

I'm sorry. I have trouble taking imaan advice from someone smokes weed and disrespects women by calling them "bitches" and being proud of the fact that he "fucks bitches".

I hear Al-Qaeda is recruiting again. Get in line. First come first serve.


Offtopic; is smoking in Islam, Mukrooh or Haram?

[*BabyGirl*]

Don't gamble.
It's a sin.

:Paper:

:angel: course not.

[Kyleoberoi]

Uncalled for.
It's annoying if someone keeps saying hendu (hindu) huna? Like wise. It's not Izlamists or Izlam. It is Islam. :) :)


:neutral:

u didnt answer my question. Would u not want 2 help me out if i were lying motionless? or would u take advantage of da situation n fuck me hard before heading back home? :neutral:

[NeRgYz]

I'm sorry. I have trouble taking imaan advice from someone smokes weed and disrespects women by calling them "bitches" and being proud of the fact that he "fucks bitches".

I hear Al-Qaeda is recruiting again. Get in line. First come first serve.

oe imam who molested 2 nine-years-old girls in my neighbourhood.....:no: ...

[TheLoneAvenger]

Offtopic; is smoking in Islam, Mukrooh or Haram?

I remember back in the day it was considered Mukrooh, but now it is being categorized as being Haram based on the fact that it causes harm to the body and offers no benefit to a person in any way.

[NeRgYz]

Offtopic; is smoking in Islam, Mukrooh or Haram?

smoking is haram coz its consider as slow suicide......the more u smoke, the more u r harming urself....and u end up having cancers.....

[*BabyGirl*]

:neutral:

u didnt answer my question. Would u not want 2 help me out if i were lying motionless? or would u take advantage of da situation n fuck me hard before heading back home? :neutral:


I wouldn't want to "fck" you either way. I'd help =)

[soladylike]

Offtopic; is smoking in Islam, Mukrooh or Haram?

Anything that has the potential to harm your body is considered haraam.
Tobacco has been proven to harm your own body and those of the ones around you.
Smoking contradicts verse 29 in from Surah Al-Nisa in the Quran that says "do not kill yourself".

[Kyleoberoi]

Oh, I agree with you. I can't stand the 'us v.s. they' mentality in ANY form, in any circumstance. Whether it be religion, or ethnicity, or language, or culture, etc.

In fact, I'll tell you something, about 'ethnicity'; it is for this reason that I can actually understand why so many Persians today felt utterly insulted by the movie 300, no? :dunno:
u have da tendency to spew out a whole load of nonsensical bullshit, mate.

[nabx]

so, we were having some discussions about organs donations and found out that there were only 3 donors in my class .....i wanted to b a donor too but i was said that its haram to donate your organs coz they are Allah's "amanat"....but isnt it sunnat to save someone's life??.....are u willing to donate ur organs too??

btw, if anyone of you take this as a joke, U R IN THE WRONG THREAD!!!!


nopes i dont think that is true , i have not heard any thing that says that it is haram !

[Spiky]

Uhh...did you not see the other Muslims contradicting him? Or is your perspective THAT biased?
We have our retards but we can't be mean to them.
It's haraam to be mean to someone who rides the short bus to school.


I did. But there are way many more SugarHILLsides on this planet than LoneAvengers.

hence my point. Whenever someone says,

1) Why does everyone hate Islam --- Its because of shitheads like SugarHILLsides

2) Why does everyone only hear about extremists --- Because being sane isnt a fucking accomplishment. But the extremists elements ofcourse win over.

3) Why does everyone talk shit about Muslims as if everyone has similar outlook --- Because of a thread like this. Apart from LoneAvenger and the other chick...no one had a conclusive reasoning of their own to fucking donate organs after death for a noble cause....I am fucking surpised people have to fukcing think about helping someone after their death. I can quote you on all the people who think donating is haram....Go figure.

4) Why does spiky think Muslims are backward and illiterate --- Coz of the threads and peoples stance on shit like this.

I can go on and on. As long as fucktards like SugarHillSides outshine LoneAvengers, your religion will always be under fucking scrutiny....And if you can observe it from a third person's perspective....you will understand why its so easy.

[soladylike]

oe imam who molested 2 nine-years-old girls in my neighbourhood.....:no: ...

Taubah!
My maulvi saab in Pakistan would always hit on my mom :no:

[Kyleoberoi]

I wouldn't want to "fck" you either way. I'd help =)
Dats da first time ive heard dat :) fuck dat. dunt lie 2 yourself..hun.. :)

[soladylike]

I did. But there are way many more SugarHILLsides on this planet than LoneAvengers.

hence my point. Whenever someone says,

1) Why does everyone hate Islam --- Its because of shitheads like SugarHILLsides

2) Why does everyone only hear about extremists --- Because being sane isnt a fucking accomplishment. But the extremists elements ofcourse win over.

3) Why does everyone talk shit about Muslims as if everyone has similar outlook --- Because of a thread like this. Apart from LoneAvenger and the other chick...no one had a conclusive reasoning of their own to fucking donate organs after death for a noble cause....I am fucking surpised people have to fukcing think about helping someone after their death. I can quote you on all the people who think donating is haram....Go figure.

4) Why does spiky think Muslims are backward and illiterate --- Coz of the threads and peoples stance on shit like this.

I can go on and on. As long as fucktards like SugarHillSides outshine LoneAvengers, your religion will always be under fucking scrutiny....And if you can observe it from a third person's perspective....you will understand why its so easy.

Majority of Muslims are like that nowadays, sweetheart.
They have yet to make a pesticide strong enough.

[hot_psychotic_ar]

Im not really sure,it's something that is still being researched on,but I've heard it was haraam.It is permitted on some situation and some not.

[Space-Cowboy]

First of all, nobody COULD prove me wrong, which is why you had to resort to this. What does my sex life have to do with basic Islamic law? WHAT?

Space-Cowboy, you aiight with me man, you're an intelligent dude and all that, which is why I'm surprised that you'd stoop that low to dig up something I posted literally a few hours ago in an attempt to attack my integrity as a muslim.

You dont know me, you dont know me to say "I dont follow my religion," you're free to assume whatever you want to assume about me based upon what I post on here, it makes no difference to me, but when we are involved in a debate about one thing, I don't think it's correct on your part to bring something entirely unrelated to the table in an attempt to save face and look good for these little e-groupies you have on RD.

Like I've said, I aint no saint, and I aint no model-muslim. I'm somebody who knows his religion though, and I can't let y'all get away with promoting straight FALSEHOOD.


I don't have groupies... I stand alone.

What is 'falsehood', exactly?

TheLoneAvenger IS a Muslim so he knows more than me, and he's shown interpretations from scholars which disagree with yours.

The rest is up to you.

[*BabyGirl*]

Dats da first time ive heard dat :) fuck dat. dunt lie 2 yourself..hun.. :)

Lol ...hmmm

[Kyleoberoi]

So what you're saying is that you'd respect me more if I kept my bad-deeds a secret and put up a front on these forums like I'm the long-awaited mahdi, or muslim saviour or something?

Na, I try to keep it 100% real at all times. If you want to fault me for that, then go ahead do so, it makes no difference because I never claimed a title for you to try and take that "title" away from me.

I just spit the real, you should respect people like me because it aint too many people like me left these days. real talk.

and Al-quaeda jokes are lame, please accquire new material.
u couldnt answer any of my questions which is y ur ignoring my posts. good job

[Space-Cowboy]

u have da tendency to spew out a whole load of nonsensical bullshit, mate.


Shut up, troll :idea:

You were already banned once for your idiocy.

You know nothing about Hinduism, nor about Islam, nor about anything in general, and certainly not about Atheism.

Get the fuck out. :arrow:

[TheLoneAvenger]

So what you're saying is that you'd respect me more if I kept my bad-deeds a secret and put up a front on these forums like I'm the long-awaited mahdi, or muslim saviour or something?

Na, I try to keep it 100% real at all times. If you want to fault me for that, then go ahead do so, it makes no difference because I never claimed a title for you to try and take that "title" away from me.


First of all, you should know that it's Islamic to conceal one's sins instead of advertising them to the entire world. That's something between a person and God.

And it's implied that all Muslims have sinned or commit sin. I have, you have, everyone. That's not even a point of debate.

And no one in this thread has really stated being religiously superior to anyone else.

[soladylike]

So what you're saying is that you'd respect me more if I kept my bad-deeds a secret and put up a front on these forums like I'm the long-awaited mahdi, or muslim saviour or something?

Na, I try to keep it 100% real at all times. If you want to fault me for that, then go ahead do so, it makes no difference because I never claimed a title for you to try and take that "title" away from me.

I just spit the real, you should respect people like me because it aint too many people like me left these days. real talk.

and Al-quaeda jokes are lame, please accquire new material.

The fact that you're on RD trying to preach Islam negates everything. I don't care what you do in your personal life. That's between you and Allah.
I'd rather take my Islamic advice from an educated scholar than someone who goes to Sheikh Google for Islam and quotes half verses from the Quran on RD.
I don't talk about Islam on RD or even get into debates on it here simply because this isn't the place for a religious discussion. People come here to unwind and act silly. We're serious enough in real life.
I tend not to talk about things I am not fully aware of either. I'm still studying Islam which is why I didn't write out a paragraph to contradict you simply because I don't have the full knowledge of it.

Do what you please. But think twice before you quote the Quran so loosely on a forum such as this.

[NeRgYz]

Taubah!
My maulvi saab in Pakistan would always hit on my mom :no:
]

coz ur maulvi need more wives.....

[Space-Cowboy]

Some good responses about smoking.

I heard this rhetoric, I don't know if it is true or not: If tobacco companies can't get you to try your first cigarette by the time you're 18, then they have failed to capture you as a 'customer'.

I guess it all comes down to good parenting, and personal choice really :dunno:

I will show my kids the most disturbing examples of lung and mouth cancer I can find.... At the very least it'll scare them away from even thinking about trying a cigarette ever in their lives? :dunno:

[soladylike]

]

coz ur maulvi need more wives.....

He had 4 ...

:neutral:

[NeRgYz]

Some good responses about smoking.

I heard this rhetoric, I don't know if it is true or not: If tobacco companies can't get you to try your first cigarette by the time you're 18, then they have failed to capture you as a 'customer'.

I guess it all comes down to good parenting, and personal choice really :dunno:

I will show my kids the most disturbing examples of lung and mouth cancer I can find.... At the very least it'll scare them away from even thinking about trying a cigarette ever in their lives? :dunno:

someday u r gonna b a good father....lol

[Space-Cowboy]

someday u r gonna b a good father....lol


I want to be a mother... :Oops:



:kekeke:

[soladylike]

Some good responses about smoking.

I heard this rhetoric, I don't know if it is true or not: If tobacco companies can't get you to try your first cigarette by the time you're 18, then they have failed to capture you as a 'customer'.

I guess it all comes down to good parenting, and personal choice really :dunno:

I will show my kids the most disturbing examples of lung and mouth cancer I can find.... At the very least it'll scare them away from even thinking about trying a cigarette ever in their lives? :dunno:

My mom took my brother and me to her medical college in Pakistan and showed us the lungs of a smoker who had just died.
After that we've been all :ihearu: to her.

[NeRgYz]

He had 4 ...

:neutral:

one of em is getting closer to death....thats he need ur mom to replace her.....

[TheLoneAvenger]

I will show my kids the most disturbing examples of lung and mouth cancer I can find.... At the very least it'll scare them away from even thinking about trying a cigarette ever in their lives? :dunno:

I'm not sure how effective showing pictures is.

Personally, I think parental involvement and setting a suitable example is the best and most effective way to manage a child's behavior.

[soladylike]

one of em is getting closer to death....thats he need ur mom to replace her.....

hahahaha!
The fact that my mumsy was already married eluded the mullah jee :p

[Space-Cowboy]

I'm not sure how effective showing pictures is.

Personally, I think parental involvement and setting a suitable example is the best and most effective way to manage a child's behavior.


I'd say it's very effective. If kids don't want to end up with a hole in their neck that they gotta breathe out of; and have to sound like a robot the rest of their lives; and be short of breath every time they climb a flight of stairs; etc., they'll make the wise choice..

[misspathani.]

Question:
What is the ruling on donating organs?.

Answer:
Praise be to Allaah.

Donating organs is not all on one level. There is the donation of organs on which life depends, and there is the donation of organs on which life does not depend.

If the donation is of an organ on which life depends, such as the heart or liver, it is not permissible to donate it, according to the consensus of the scholars, because that is killing a soul.

But if it is an organ on which life does not depend, such as a kidney or blood vessels, then there is a difference of opinion among contemporary scholars, and there are two views on this matter:

1 – That it is permissible to transplant human organs

2 – That it is not permissible to transplant human organs

Fatwas stating that it is permissible have been issued by a number of conferences, seminars and committees, including: the International Islamic Conference held in Malaysia; the majority of the Islamic Fiqh Council, whose fatwa may be seen in the answer to question no. 2117; the Council of Senior Scholars in the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia; and the Fatwa Committees in Jordan, Kuwait, Egypt and Algeria.

It is also the view of a number of scholars and researchers, including Shaykh ‘Abd al-Rahmaan ibn Sa’di.

Some of the scholars favoured the view that transplants are permissible on condition that the donor is a harbi kaafir (i.e., one who is in a state of war against Islam, not one with whom the Muslims have a treaty, or who is living under Muslim protection), because the harbi kaafir has no sanctity, whereas the sanctity of the Muslim is established in life and in death.

For more information see the book Ahkaam al-Jaraahah al-Tibbiyyah by Shaykh Muhammad al-Mukhtaar al-Shanqeeti, pp. 354-391

And Allaah knows best.

Islam Q&A


source- http://www.islam-qa.com/index.php?ref=49711&ln=eng&txt=organs

[peanut_joe]

Honestly this is all pretty fucking retarded.

If the Prophet(saw) forbade us from even MIGRATING TO NON-MUSLIM COUNTRIES, and living amongst the kufar, then how the FUCK can it be permissble to "help" the kufar?

what version of Islaam are y'all practicing?


you swore, we get to cut your tongue off.... :rolleyes:




fucking idiots these days. hypocrites.

[Spiky]

If the donation is of an organ on which life depends, such as the heart or liver, it is not permissible to donate it, according to the consensus of the scholars, because that is killing a soul.

But if it is an organ on which life does not depend, such as a kidney or blood vessels, then there is a difference of opinion among contemporary scholars, and there are two views on this matter:

1 – That it is permissible to transplant human organs

2 – That it is not permissible to transplant human organs




So much for fucking religious hypocrisy. I can bet million bucks if the Sheikh of some Saudi ever needed a fucking transplant, he will rewrite the fucking fatwas just to suit their needs. and then we have billion other muslims blindly following what some douchebag extremist must have interpreted from Quran on their own.

So much so, even the shit she stated has no conclusion.

1) It is haram to donate lungs or heart for it has soul [AFTER DEATH???? :wtf:]

2) It is debatable if donating kidneys and liver is haram or not.

NO FUCKING DECISION MADE AND SHE WANTED TO POST THAT SHIT UP HERE AS IF IT MADE ANY SENSE.

[TheLoneAvenger]

Everybody wants to believe that Islaam is this religion that can co-exist with other religions, and we can all sing, dance, and hold hands in fields of green grass and colorful flowers, it's all BULLSHIT fam, you may not believe it's bullshit because you, hell, even me, are spoiled by all the comforts of this world. My man this is nothing but DUNYA...ILLUSION designed to take you farther and farther away from the HAQQ that will ultimately save you from the fire.


Okay, last response.

Yes, Islam is the best path to God's mercy and forgiveness to enter Heaven. If I, and other Muslims didn't believe this, than I wouldn't be Muslim.

But contrary to what you state, Islam can co exist with other religions and the Quran directly states this numerous times.

To every People have We appointed rites and ceremonies which they must follow, let them not then dispute with you on the matter, but do invite (them) to your Lord: for you are assuredly on the Right Way. If they do wrangle with you, say, 'God knows best what it is you are doing.' 'God will judge between you on the Day of Judgment concerning the matters in which you differ') (Al-Hajj 21:76-69).

I consider Islam to be the true religion, but that doesn't mean I can't co-exist with non-Muslims as accepting Islam is a personal choice. If they choose not too, that's fine.




After all, who are the ones who propogate all this happy-go-lucky shit that you like to advocate? The same people who have their foot placed firmly on the necks of muslims worldwide, that's who. These are the same people who draw offensive cartoons of OUR PROPHET(SAW) and expect us not to get angry, then de-humanize and demonize us when we do. The same people who want us to change the ways of our religion and alter the words of our prophet(saw) are the same people who would like to see us dissolve into nothing more than multiple sects, scattered and shifted across the planet where we dont pose a threat to them and their way of life. Well, fuck that.


First off, the response (riots etc) to the Danish cartoons was completely out of line. Yes, Muslims have a right to be angry but to cause undue violence is unacceptable.

People wanted to bait any Muslims into an extreme response just to have an "AHA" moment, and unfortunately they got what they wanted. The best response would have been ignoring the situation. Similarly, don't you think the whole fatwa situation with Rushdie led to his book becoming even more popular, which is the exact opposite of what any Muslim wanted?

Point blank period: Islaam is the ONLY RELIGION THAT WILL BE ACCEPTED BY ALLAH(SWT) ON THE DAY OF JUDGEMENT. PERIOD.

I don't think any Muslim is arguing this point. You're just brining in exogenous statements for no reason. Also, according to Islam, shirk is basically the only sin that is unforgiveable by God hence no one really knows who is and who isn't going to receive the mercy of God.

There's a fairly famous hadith of a prostitute giving a thirsty dog water from a well when no one else would, and God forgave her of her sins, even though she wasn't a Muslim.

So yes, Islam is the true faith, but it preaches tolerance of other religions and customs.

[peanut_joe]

cutting someones tongue out for swearing isn't a part of sharee'ah.

and even if it was, we aren't living under laws based on sharee'ah, so you couldn't do it anyway.


so stop preaching to us then.

[Spiky]

aint nobody trying to "preach Islam" here, I dont create threads related to Islaam.

If you're going to beef over that, then why dont you beef with the threadstarter, since she asked her question on these forums, instead of directing it towards her imaam, or someone at her masjid?

You may disagree with my tone, or the flavor of my wording but that doesn't deduct from the truth that I'm speaking.

Everybody wants to believe that Islaam is this religion that can co-exist with other religions, and we can all sing, dance, and hold hands in fields of green grass and colorful flowers, it's all BULLSHIT fam, you may not believe it's bullshit because you, hell, even me, are spoiled by all the comforts of this world. My man this is nothing but DUNYA...ILLUSION designed to take you farther and farther away from the HAQQ that will ultimately save you from the fire.

After all, who are the ones who propogate all this happy-go-lucky shit that you like to advocate? The same people who have their foot placed firmly on the necks of muslims worldwide, that's who. These are the same people who draw offensive cartoons of OUR PROPHET(SAW) and expect us not to get angry, then de-humanize and demonize us when we do. The same people who want us to change the ways of our religion and alter the words of our prophet(saw) are the same people who would like to see us dissolve into nothing more than multiple sects, scattered and shifted across the planet where we dont pose a threat to them and their way of life. Well, fuck that.

Point blank period: Islaam is the ONLY RELIGION THAT WILL BE ACCEPTED BY ALLAH(SWT) ON THE DAY OF JUDGEMENT. PERIOD.

If you're muslim, then you need to get over your bullshit emotions and submit to this fact because you've been blessed enough to have already become familiar with the deen. Dont ruin it, and dont sacrafice your birthright just for the sake of pleasing "moderates," because I'm telling you right now, Allah(swt) doesn't accept moderacy, he expects pure and unadulterated SUBMISSION, which is the TRUE DEFINITION of ISLAAM. NOT "peace."


YOU ARE ONE CRAZY MOTHAFUCKAA...CRAZIER THAN FUCKING KHANBABA_ OR MAYBE ABOUT THE SAME.

[Spiky]

actually you fucking idiot, lots of people tried to help the late Shaykh, and former MUFTI of Saudi Arabia IBN BAZ in such a manner due to all his health problems, but he refused. He's since passed away.

this is exactly what I mean, people dont know what the fuck they talking about yet insist on runnin' their jibs.


LMAO. well then, He must have been accepting organs. Why would it be haram according to your own logic?

[Space-Cowboy]

Again, this isn't an Islamic forum, this is a forum where people discuss whatever. Occasionally I, or any other muslim may say or do something contrary to Islamic law...this IS NOT THE ISSUE.

This all stemmed from me stating that is is definitely haraam to donate organs to non-muslims, or to aid them in such a way when there are muslims who suffer just as much, if not more in this day and age.

and then everybody went ape-shit on me.

And your man space-cowboy wants to try and discredit my words, which are FACTS based on Qur'aan and Sunnah, by bringing up something COMPLETELY IRRELEVANT to the issue at hand. That is a BITCH MOVE. That is what people resort to when they cant win an argument.

I can sin all day and all night, but if I state that there is no God but Allah(swt) and Muhammad is his messenger, will you agree or disagree?

Discredit what? I have nothing vested in this thread. Insofar as winning this argument, I wasn't even aware that I was involved in a debate.

However, I do know this; I have Muslim friends, who are very close friends of mine, they are near and dear to me, just like the other friends I have from all other walks of life. And they feel the same way about me.

That is all.

[Seriously???]

so, we were having some discussions about organs donations and found out that there were only 3 donors in my class .....i wanted to b a donor too but i was said that its haram to donate your organs coz they are Allah's "amanat"....but isnt it sunnat to save someone's life??.....are u willing to donate ur organs too??

btw, if anyone of you take this as a joke, U R IN THE WRONG THREAD!!!!

that's correct. Allah's a great juggler. u'll never kno when & how the stomach pops up in the air & comes back down as liver...they're all his.


Seriously??? :-s

[ilyas@!!oops!!]

this was a simple thread now it's gone into Serious drama thread

:no:

[Space-Cowboy]

my dude you cared enough to try and "expose" me, I mean, I dont know why you went through all that trouble, did you think I forgot I posted that thread earlier or something?

If you had nothing vested in this thread, if you aren't even a muslim, then you should have stayed out of it. If 3 hindus are having a discussion over what insect a rapist will be reincarnated as in his next life , I wouldn't try to chime in with my thoughts, and i feel that you should conduct yourself in the same manner.

and if you're trying to bait me to say something negative about your muslim friends, dont even waste your time. That's not what I do.


My specific purpose in this thread? To try and understand the irrational mindset of discriminating amongst who you want as friends merely based on their religion.

To try and understand.... I haven't understood, so I guess I've failed.

[jumpn jza]

LOL...ure dead....dont be a selfish cunt - u dont need your organs - just give em away....

[Seriously???]

What do you mean, I just said he refused.

As for muslims donating organs to other muslims, that is an issue that the alim'(people of knowledge) must deal with, I'm in no position to judge things like that.

I will however tell you that donating organs to non-muslims is most definitely haraam, and that's the reason we've been arguing for all this time.

so muslims rather let a person die than donate? how pathetic is that!


Seriously??? :-s

[*BabyGirl*]

so muslims rather let a person die than donate? how pathetic is that!


Seriously??? :-s

:no:

that's not what he's trying to say ......

[NeRgYz]

this was a simple thread now it's gone into Serious drama thread

:no:



this is gonna b my last thread after seeing how many of them are getting serious.....:no:

[Kyleoberoi]

Shut up, troll :idea:

You were already banned once for your idiocy.

You know nothing about Hinduism, nor about Islam, nor about anything in general, and certainly not about Atheism.

Get the fuck out. :arrow:
Look whose talking.. LOL I know nothing about Hinduism n ur da one who comes up wid atheist threads yet u claim ur hindu. Fock mate… u aint hindu… u atheist fucktard. ur a twat living in ur delusional world tryin 2 blend hinduism wid atheism 2 fulfill ur delusional fantasies. Ive never attemped 2 correct u but I do choke on my all bran with a mixture of hilarity n derision every time I've read ur bullshit on Hinduism [which by da way is a mixture of atheism].

U’ve read far too many books on atheism… 2 a point where u ve envisaged ur own bullshit 2 fit ur atheist views in2 hindu doctrine. U know nothing about Hinduism infact, ur da last worthless scum one should approach 2 gain knowledge on hinduism. U get ur way by labyrinthine maneuvering but any logician can take u for a ride of a life time. Quit ur fake persona, shitbag. :idea:

[Seriously???]

:no:

that's not what he's trying to say ......

ok fine. the idea behind that statement may not be so "barbaric", but what if a non-muslim on the verge of death needs an organ transplant & the only match is a muslim?
cuz that previous comment seems to be what a dumb cock-eyed local imam would preach.


Seriously??? :-s

[desi_playa]

hmm this is interesting ... i also wanna know the answer!


i never heard that it was haraam though...


lol i love it how this concerns you but posting pictures while bieng drunk makes you proud.

[desi_playa]

i am sure if your organs can save another humans life they is nothing wrong with it.


i am sure muslim countries dont bring parts to save humans life from like america.

[Space-Cowboy]

Look whose talking.. LOL I know nothing about Hinduism n ur da one who comes up wid atheist threads yet u claim ur hindu. Fock mate… u aint hindu… u atheist fucktard. ur a twat living in ur delusional world tryin 2 blend hinduism wid atheism 2 fulfill ur delusional fantasies. Ive never attemped 2 correct u but I do choke on my all bran with a mixture of hilarity n derision every time I've read ur bullshit on Hinduism [which by da way is a mixture of atheism].

U’ve read far too many books on atheism… 2 a point where u ve envisaged ur own bullshit 2 fit ur atheist views in2 hindu doctrine. U know nothing about Hinduism infact, ur da last worthless scum one should approach 2 gain knowledge on hinduism. U get ur way by labyrinthine maneuvering but any logician can take u for a ride of a life time. Quit ur fake persona, shitbag. :idea:


^^^This is what's wrong with Hinduism. Dumbshits like you that don't know one piece of information on Hinduism, or anything else for that matter, and troll into threads with your random brain-farts. You spout shit thirty ways from sunday. Go read a fucking book, dumbass, cuz you're the last person to be representing Hinduism. If you practiced even one tenth of the Sanatani teachings, you wouldn't post anywhere near the amount of garbage that you do on the forums.

PS: I'm not an atheist. :idea:



edit: If you want people to even begin to take you seriously, stop bastardizing the English language, you dumb fuck. :idea:

[H. S. P.]

I dont recall reading anywhere in the Quran whether its haraam to donate an organ -- for obvious reasons. Therefore, whatever people say nowadays on this topic is strictly their interpretation on the Quran and Hadiths.

So, keeping that in mind, I wont believe anyone if they told me that its haraam because in the end, it can only do good.

Disclaimer: This is my personal opinion so lay off the onslaught of insults and 'kafir' comments.


I also agree. I don't believe it to be haraam and as far as I've read in the Quran, I haven't seen any mention of donating an organ to a needy person is haraam.

Two thumbs up.

[chutney whore]

What if someone close (like a bro/sis/mum/dad) to you needed a kidney? or some liver...

i would do it. I donate blood, well before when i could...is that allowed? :|

[ilyas@!!oops!!]

this is gonna b my last thread after seeing how many of them are getting serious.....:no:
silly kids on here......take everything serious :no:

[baby khan]

so, we were having some discussions about organs donations and found out that there were only 3 donors in my class .....i wanted to b a donor too but i was said that its haram to donate your organs coz they are Allah's "amanat"....but isnt it sunnat to save someone's life??.....are u willing to donate ur organs too??

btw, if anyone of you take this as a joke, U R IN THE WRONG THREAD!!!!
im not an organ donor but my dad is.....but yes its haraam though

[NeRgYz]

silly kids on here......take everything serious :no:


tsk....da reason i made this thread is for my tomorrow's science exam....i was given a question about this and so i thought it would b pretty interesting if i post it here....but instead, these pplz turned my topic into religion.....

[NeRgYz]

im not an organ donor but my dad is.....but yes its haraam though


sana....i have read everyone's points of views and i dont see why its haram to donate organs.....donate=charity ....charity=one of the 5th pillar of Islam.....

[desi_balla63]

sana....i have read everyone's points of views and i dont see why its haram to donate organs.....donate=charity ....charity=one of the 5th pillar of Islam.....
That logic doesn't really apply.

What if you're donating Pig and Alchohol? There are certain exceptions, I'm sure.

[desi_balla63]

What if someone close (like a bro/sis/mum/dad) to you needed a kidney? or some liver...

i would do it. I donate blood, well before when i could...is that allowed? :|

I won't even ask.

[baby khan]

sana....i have read everyone's points of views and i dont see why its haram to donate organs.....donate=charity ....charity=one of the 5th pillar of Islam.....
yes i deff agree with what your saying but ive heard that when you die ur spirit or w/e is alive and what not and you feel the pain when your organs are being taken out....idk im going to pakistan this month im gonna ask alot of people there if this is true or not

[Wind Walker]

yes i deff agree with what your saying but ive heard that when you die ur spirit or w/e is alive and what not and you feel the pain when your organs are being taken out....idk im going to pakistan this month im gonna ask alot of people there if this is true or not


everything is mentioned in Quran, recite surah Kahaf (i thinnk in 24 or 21 pa'arah) with translation, believe me you'll get all the answers.

[Kyleoberoi]

^^^This is what's wrong with Hinduism. Dumbshits like you that don't know one piece of information on Hinduism, or anything else for that matter, and troll into threads with your random brain-farts. You spout shit thirty ways from sunday. Go read a fucking book, dumbass, cuz you're the last person to be representing Hinduism. If you practiced even one tenth of the Sanatani teachings, you wouldn't post anywhere near the amount of garbage that you do on the forums.

PS: I'm not an atheist. :idea:



edit: If you want people to even begin to take you seriously, stop bastardizing the English language, you dumb fuck. :idea:
Nothings more entertaining than feeling da pain and anguish of a fucktard whose intricate logic and stance on hinduism is in question n he cant afford 2 lose da hard earned respect of an online desi community. Wat these desis [including our hindus] arnt aware of is da fact dat u dunt have da slightest clue of Hinduism yet u claim 2 be a Hindu. Fuck dat.

I’ve read far too many books on true hindu doctrine n I’m well ahead of you in hinduism. U may have managed 2 fool innocent ppl wid ur delusory doctrine but u cant deceive logicians. Any hindu logician can point out da fact dat ur convoluted and deceptive hindu doctrine includes large chunks of preconceived atheist doctrine which, in all reality, has nothing 2 do wid Hinduism. Get ur wacked facts right before u tell me 2 go read a book. :idea:


Ps. U’ve edited ur post about 5 times. Must be thinkin of ways 2 put me down… just coz ive managed 2 look past ur delusory pleasures. Sume one had 2 do it, mate. Sume one had 2 bring u out of your fantasy world in2 da realm of mortals. :idea:

[NeRgYz]

That logic doesn't really apply.

What if you're donating Pig and Alchohol? There are certain exceptions, I'm sure.

now where da hell pig and alcohol has come from??

[Space-Cowboy]

Ahh, where to begin to completely dissect this piece of verbal diarrhea you call a post...

Nothings more entertaining than feeling da pain and anguish of a fucktard whose intricate logic and stance on hinduism is in question n he cant afford 2 lose da hard earned respect of an online desi community. Wat these desis [including our hindus] arnt aware of is da fact dat u dunt have da slightest clue of Hinduism yet u claim 2 be a Hindu. Fuck dat.

Actually it's clear from this fucking post you don't know what the first thing about Sanatani is. I'm willing to bet you're a Hindutva puppet.... but even that would give you too much credit.

I’ve read far too many books on true hindu doctrine n I’m well ahead of you in hinduism.

"Ahead" Are you fucking serious? For one thing, I'm not an atheist, but the fact that you can't see how there are distinct Atheistic schools of thought in Hinduism just goes to show how retardedly warped your view of the world is. And judging by the way you spell, I'm pretty sure you can't read above a grade 10 level to begin with so I'm quite curious what books you've read. :idea:

U may have managed 2 fool innocent ppl wid ur delusory doctrine but u cant deceive logicians. Any hindu logician can point out da fact dat ur convoluted and deceptive hindu doctrine includes large chunks of preconceived atheist doctrine which, in all reality, has nothing 2 do wid Hinduism. Get ur wacked facts right before u tell me 2 go read a book. :idea:

And again, the fact that you haven't heard of specific Atheistic schools of thought in Hinduism just goes to show you how delusional YOU are. How bout you stop getting your so called 'facts' from Hindutva sites and we'll talk. Until then, don't fucking bother to approach me, dumbshit, cuz it's clear you know nothing about Hinduism, or any Eastern spirituality for that matter.

And quit using the word 'logician', you're not using it correctly, and even if you were, logic is something far removed from any one of your bullshit posts on these forums.


Ps. U’ve edited ur post about 5 times. Must be thinkin of ways 2 put me down… just coz ive managed 2 look past ur delusory pleasures. Sume one had 2 do it, mate. Sume one had 2 bring u out of your fantasy world in2 da realm of mortals. :idea:

The only thing you've managed to look past are the facts. The fact being you're one sheltered little idiot.

Fortunately when most people talk to you, they'll know how deluded you are, and won't try to learn about Hinduism from you.

Now quit being butthurt that every thread you enter into, you get owned by everyone left, right, and center. You know jack shit about Hinduism, or any Eastern tradition, and that's just the reality, so either go pick up the Gita and get back to your Sanatani roots, or fucking deal with the fact that you don't know your shit.

:idea:

[di vinci]

yeh it is haram 100% because your soul is still alive when your dead

so you will feel the pain if someone was to cut you up!

:neutral:

illyas is right. beacause according to the buriel procss a human body must be cleanse with luke warm water so the soul dosnt not feel discomfort. it should be take care of it. minor donation like one kidney or blood is permisble before death but after death it is haram. because on teh day of judgement every one will be ressurected. certain islamic schools also frown upon the idea of having heart transplants etc. this is too deep for u rd goons to understand :D

[di vinci]

everything is mentioned in Quran, recite surah Kahaf (i thinnk in 24 or 21 pa'arah) with translation, believe me you'll get all the answers.


dont waste ur time dude half of these rd muslim r watless about their own faith. hold u breath n have a orange juice

[NeRgYz]

dont waste ur time dude half of these rd muslim r watless about their own faith. hold u breath n have a orange juice


hmmm.....orange juice.....

[NeRgYz]

wow....read this:

Two Florida parents agreed to donate the heart, liver, kidneys, and pancreas of their recently deceased son as long as the organs went to white recipients. Their son was a former member of the Ku Klux Klan, so they directed their donations away from ethnic groups that their son hated in order to honour his beliefs. Shockingly, the hospital agreed. Later, the state of Florida changed the law so that this kind of thing would not be allowed to happen again.


here's another that has NOTHING to do wit this thread:

If a murderer, pedophile, or rapist decides to donate an organ, does the recipient have a right to know this information? Would you want the kidney of a pedophile put into your body? What if you were the victim of a pedophile?

[SarcasmicBengali]

sadly...
hopefully one day people will learn to think for themselves
and this doesnt mean that they have to stop believing in their religions, but atleast they wouldnt blindly be following something

well thats the thing... ppl take religion as a substitute for rational thought
there's VERY few people in the world that are truly religious... but whose thoughts are independant of religious propaganda... and who can objectively question religion and still live a good life...

while there's the 'fanatics' or 'extremists' and mostly ig'nant ppl who replace logical thinking with religious teachings...

i doubt that will change any time soon... i hope it does... but there's a LOT of idiots in the world :no:

[desi_balla63]

now where da hell pig and alcohol has come from??
It "has come from" this post of yours:

sana....i have read everyone's points of views and i dont see why its haram to donate organs.....donate=charity ....charity=one of the 5th pillar of Islam.....

To which I replied:

That logic doesn't really apply.

What if you're donating Pig and Alchohol? There are certain exceptions, I'm sure.

[TYPE_R_GINO]

yeaaa....that exactly what imam has told us.....

ive heard that autopsies should also try and be avoided it possible

[~*~ayesha~*~]

Salaam!

I am an organ donor...But my uncle and abba both told me it is Haram. Basically, they said on the day of Judgment, all our body parts will answer to Allah. And God will ask us why we did what we did with our lives. Our tongues will speak for itself, our eyes, our hands, our liver...etc. I don't know if this is true or not, but i've heard this my entire life.

Although i was raised to believe it was haram, i continue to be an organ donor. How can trying to save a life be a sin? Its selfish for me to keep my body parts after i am dead.

YES, the soul lives on after we die, but our physical body is NOT our soul. they are TWO different entities completely.

I feel as if being an organ donor is beneficial to society, and that's why i do it.

I hear it is haram though?!

[Coitys]

yeh it is haram 100% because your soul is still alive when your dead

so you will feel the pain if someone was to cut you up!

:neutral:
Agreed. The weight of a fly will hurt bad enough after death.

[di vinci]

Salaam!

I am an organ donor...But my uncle and abba both told me it is Haram. Basically, they said on the day of Judgment, all our body parts will answer to Allah. And God will ask us why we did what we did with our lives. Our tongues will speak for itself, our eyes, our hands, our liver...etc. I don't know if this is true or not, but i've heard this my entire life.

Although i was raised to believe it was haram, i continue to be an organ donor. How can trying to save a life be a sin? Its selfish for me to keep my body parts after i am dead.

YES, the soul lives on after we die, but our physical body is NOT our soul. they are TWO different entities completely.

I feel as if being an organ donor is beneficial to society, and that's why i do it.

I hear it is haram though?!

theres a full hadith on this subject. ur body and soul r one, is ur gift from god so u need to take care of it n avoid, things that can have ill efect on u, smoking, consuming unhealthy food, consuming way too much alcohol. u need ur body to be ressurected on the day of judgement if ur missing parts then u will be in enternal torment

[~*~ayesha~*~]

^^^^ Well if you can please post a LEGIT hadith, then i will honestly stop being one. But ihave never seen any real proof. Only heard of it,

Please post something...and then i will know for sure it is haram...and that way i can change my ways for the better!


Thanks!

[WildWolfdog]

There's some debate as to whether it's allowed Islamically. Basically the two schools of though oppose (one allowing and one disallowing).

It doesn't desecrate the body and it gives on going charity after life, plus I don't think I've ever heard of a Muslim refusing an organ transplant. Based on this, I'm fine with organ donation and have no moral qualms about it.

Yep. Aside from that, you're saving someone else's life and Allah encourages helping others in any way you can. And if you're dead, your organs are essentially useless to yourself.

As for the "it's not yours to give away" argument, that argument is kinda silly imo because it was be used in almost every argument otherwise - besides you're not giving it away for money or to spite Allah or anything stupid along those lines.

http://www.islamonline.net/servlet/Satellite?cid=1119503543346&pagename=IslamOnline-English-Ask_Scholar/FatwaE/FatwaEAskTheScholar

I know, it's just an online source, but Dr. Muzammil Siddiqi is generally well regarded and offers pretty sound explanations.

Good link :yes:

[WildWolfdog]

The thread-starter asked a question, and I answered her.

Your personal feelings about the issue are irrelevant.

Man you're full of bullshit. Your answers were fed by personal feelings regarding certain issues.

[WildWolfdog]

Yes, and?

Allah chooses who is muslim and who is not - is very close to sounding like predestination doesn't it, :ugh2:

[*BabyGirl*]

Man you're full of bullshit. Your answers were fed by personal feelings regarding certain issues.


He doesn't kiss ass like most of You on here and I like him for that =D
As for his "answers" they aren't personally related in anyway. He quoted from the quran. Anyway this threads over. :wave:

[WildWolfdog]

He doesn't kiss ass like most of You on here and I like him for that =D
As for his "answers" they aren't personally related in anyway. He quoted from the quran. Anyway this threads over. :wave:

What does the issue have to do anything with kissing ass? There's something called interpretation, be it of the hadith or the Quran. His interpretation seemed to be of the hard-line approach "don't be friends with non-muslims, don't help non-muslims" etc etc, that's what I read up till page 5 or 6 anyway. If you agree with him, that's your choice but claiming this thread is over is pretty stupid lol - it wasn't even your thread to begin with.

so :wave:

[Space-Cowboy]

What does the issue have to do anything with kissing ass? There's something called interpretation, be it of the hadith or the Quran. His interpretation seemed to be of the hard-line approach "don't be friends with non-muslims, don't help non-muslims" etc etc, that's what I read up till page 5 or 6 anyway. If you agree with him, that's your choice but claiming this thread is over is pretty stupid lol - it wasn't even your thread to begin with.

so :wave:


You're a little late in this thread here aren't you? :p

[WildWolfdog]

You're a little late in this thread here aren't you? :p

Lol i didn't see it earlier :ashamed: I hate missing out on threads where I would've wanted to contribute lol - then I end up posting replies anyway consecutively, even though I know no one will read em lol.

[TheLoneAvenger]

He doesn't kiss ass like most of You on here and I like him for that =D
As for his "answers" they aren't personally related in anyway. He quoted from the quran. Anyway this threads over. :wave:

Please. He was also spouting off how it's haram to attend the funeral of a non-Muslim, something that I have never heard before. Yes participating in a type of religious ceremony is not allowed, but going to a funeral is not.

Islam preaches helping Muslims. That isn't a point of debate. Zakah is there to help Muslims but I have never heard until this thread that it would be even considered haram to donate/give charity to non-Muslims as well. I guess my donations to the Red Cross are going to anger God, which I do not believe for a second.

The Prophet (pbuh) was the first one to seek alliances with non-Muslims and came to the aid of non-Muslims on numerous occassions. I mean, he sought refuge along with other Muslims in Abyssinia, a Christian nation, when they were being persecuted.

[WildWolfdog]

Please. He was also spouting off how it's haram to attend the funeral of a non-Muslim, something that I have never heard before. Yes participating in a type of religious ceremony is not allowed, but going to a funeral is not.

Islam preaches helping Muslims. That isn't a point of debate. Zakah is there to help Muslims but I have never heard until this thread that it would be even considered haram to donate/give charity to non-Muslims as well. I guess my donations to the Red Cross are going to anger God, which I do not believe for a second.

The Prophet (pbuh) was the first one to seek alliances with non-Muslims and came to the aid of non-Muslims on numerous occassions. I mean, he sought refuge along with other Muslims in Abyssinia, a Christian nation, when they were being persecuted.

Lol bro that's what I saw too and I was like wth ... lol basically what he's saying is FMBM (for muslims, by muslims - yes I made that up, yes I know it's stupid lol :hand: ). Good point made with the red cross reference. He's almost preaching for an isolated muslim society where you don't need to get help from non-muslims and you don't need to help them either, that's pretty stupid.

[Space-Cowboy]

Lol i didn't see it earlier :ashamed: I hate missing out on threads where I would've wanted to contribute lol - then I end up posting replies anyway consecutively, even though I know no one will read em lol.


Just so you know, when me and SugarHill had a go, I wasn't dissing Islam in any way, I was just point out to him, shall we say, the benefits of "practice what ye preach" :p I have very close friends who are Muslims... in fact, I have very close friends from all walks of life.....

[Mr_MaSaLa]

so, we were having some discussions about organs donations and found out that there were only 3 donors in my class .....i wanted to b a donor too but i was said that its haram to donate your organs coz they are Allah's "amanat"....but isnt it sunnat to save someone's life??.....are u willing to donate ur organs too??

btw, if anyone of you take this as a joke, U R IN THE WRONG THREAD!!!!

Try GOOGLE: "organ donation in islam" ... but just to help you out:


Wa `alaykum As-Salamu wa Rahmatullahi wa Barakatuh.

In the Name of Allah, Most Gracious, Most Merciful.

All praise and thanks are due to Allah, and peace and blessings be upon His Messenger.

Dear questioner, we would like to thank you for the great confidence you place in us, and we implore Allah Almighty to help us serve His cause and render our work for His Sake.


In his response to your question, Sheikh Ahmad Kutty, a senior lecturer and an Islamic scholar at the Islamic Institute of Toronto, Ontario, Canada, issues the following Fatwa:


"Organ donation is permitted in Islam if it is done within the permissible limits prescribed by the Shari`ah.

The following are the conditions scholars have stipulated for donation:

Conditions associated with a living donor:

1. He/she must be a person who is in full possession of his/her faculties so that he/she is able to make a sound decision by himself/herself;

2. He/she must be an adult and, preferably, at least twenty-one years old;

3. It should be done on his/her own free will without any external pressure exerted on him/ her;

4. The organ he/she is donating must not be a vital organ on which his/her survival or sound health is dependent upon;

5. No transplantation of sexual organs is allowed.


Conditions associated with deceased donors:

1. It must be done after having ascertained the free consent of the donor prior to his /her death. It can be through a will to that effect, or signing the donor card, etc.

2. In a case where organ donation consent was not given prior to a donor’s death, the consent may be granted by the deceased’s closest relatives who are in a position to make such decisions on his/her behalf.

3. It must be an organ or tissue that is medically determined to be able to save the life or maintain the quality of life of another human being.

4. The organ must be removed only from the deceased person after the death has been ascertained through reliable medical procedures.

5. Organs can also be harvested from the victims of traffic accidents if their identities are unknown, but it must be done only following the valid decree of a judge."

[TheLoneAvenger]

what he's saying is FMBM (for muslims, by muslims - yes I made that up, yes I know it's stupid lol :hand: )

Hah.

I smell a T shirt design and possible clothing company.

[Laila_Gee]

Islam and organ donation
One of the basic aims of the Muslim faith is the saving of life. This is a fundamental aim of the Shariah and Allah greatly rewards those who save others from death.

Violating the human body, whether living or dead, is normally forbidden in Islam. The Shariah, however, waives this prohibition in a number of instances: firstly in cases of necessity; and secondly in saving another person's life. It is this Islamic legal maxim al-darurat tubih al-mahzurat (necessities overrule prohibition) that has great relevance to organ donation.

"Whosoever saves the life of one person it would be as if he saved the life of all mankind."

Holy Qur'an, chapter 5 vs. 32
"If you happened to be ill and in need of a transplant, you certainly would wish that someone would help you by providing the needed organ."

[Space-Cowboy]

yeah and that would make sense if I were 'preaching' to people about the dangers of promiscuity and/or having sex before marriage...or if I called someone a ho' or something to that effect, but I wasn't, and I never have soooooooo......


http://i7.photobucket.com/albums/y290/calmislamly/swing_and_miss_2.jpg


Hmm.. fair enough.




A simple question though: Do you have any non-Muslim friends?

[WildWolfdog]

I thought this thread died, but whatever....

Yes, pre-destination is part of a muslims aqeedah.

No it's not, that was precisely my point.

[tronangel]

No it's not, that was precisely my point.

some things are not in your control for example choosing to drink alcohol or not, and other things are not in your control like if bus hits you.

[WildWolfdog]

some things are not in your control for example choosing to drink alcohol or not, and other things are not in your control like if bus hits you.

lol you mean some thing are in your control? haha I know what you're saying though and it's true - but a lot of people confuse the fact that Allah knows everything with predestination, that he designed for us to be sinners, pious, etc.

[khanbaba_]

No it's not, that was precisely my point.
Its one of the fundamental article of Imaan, and its fardh to believe in predestination.

[khanbaba_]

lol you mean some thing are in your control? haha I know what you're saying though and it's true - but a lot of people confuse the fact that Allah knows everything with predestination, that he designed for us to be sinners, pious, etc.
Even before the creation of the Creation, Allaah knew about all the good and bad, Imaan and kufr, guidance and deviation, obedience and disobedience, that was to occur. He knew what actions were to take place etc. He knew the conditions of things. Everything was in His Knowledge even before their creation and all of it was recorded.

[WildWolfdog]

Its one of the fundamental article of Imaan, and its fardh to believe in predestination.

Even before the creation of the Creation, Allaah knew about all the good and bad, Imaan and kufr, guidance and deviation, obedience and disobedience, that was to occur. He knew what actions were to take place etc. He knew the conditions of things. Everything was in His Knowledge even before their creation and all of it was recorded.

Like I said, there's a difference between believing that Allah knows and knew all and believing in predestination.

A certain christain sect believes that God has already chosen from a select few and decided who will go to heaven and who will go to hell - that's predestination. If that's the case, why do any of us need to act in a certain manner? I mean if we're already predestined to go to hell, doing good deeds isn't going to change that.

We believe (my interpretation anyway, which I'm sure a lot of people agree with) that Allah knows everything but he has given us the freedom to choose what we will and won't do and how we'll act. That's why we're supposed to be higher than any species and are different than animals - because we have free will, we can think and make choices of our choosing, of our own will. If there's predestination then there's no free will, which equates us to animals, no?

[Space-Cowboy]

Like I said, there's a difference between believing that Allah knows and knew all and believing in predestination.

A certain christain sect believes that God has already chosen from a select few and decided who will go to heaven and who will go to hell - that's predestination. If that's the case, why do any of us need to act in a certain manner? I mean if we're already predestined to go to hell, doing good deeds isn't going to change that.

We believe (my interpretation anyway, which I'm sure a lot of people agree with) that Allah knows everything but he has given us the freedom to choose what we will and won't do and how we'll act. That's why we're supposed to be higher than any species and are different than animals - because we have free will, we can think and make choices of our choosing, of our own will. If there's predestination then there's no free will, which equates us to animals, no?


Wouldn't an animal enjoy a little bit of free will too from your above explanation, just by default?

For example:

When a pack of wolves goes on the attack of your typical bison [I'm a Manitoban, it's all about wolves and bisons :p].... The alpha wolf will in fact [studies have shown] 'decide' on a particular plan of attack and then communicate it through to the other wolves.. via voice [barks/yelps] and via sign language [wagging of tale in certain patterns, pawing, etc.]...

So, in that sense, doesn't an animal, with respect to its own little world, within the context of what you said above, exhibit free will as well?

[khanbaba_]

Like I said, there's a difference between believing that Allah knows and knew all and believing in predestination.
That is predestinations that Allah knows everything from eternity. The literal meaning of Taqdeer or predestination is to plan something beforehand. Like how a person will plan a house before building it, so too did Allaah ‘plan’ this entire universe, which was always existent in His Knowledge.


We believe (my interpretation anyway, which I'm sure a lot of people agree with) that Allah knows everything but he has given us the freedom to choose what we will and won't do and how we'll act. That's why we're supposed to be higher than any species and are different than animals - because we have free will, we can think and make choices of our choosing, of our own will. If there's predestination then there's no free will, which equates us to animals, no?

The Knowledge of with the actions of His servants is such that it does not restrict the actions of man. The Knowledge of Allaah Ta`ala has this connection with the actions of man, that Allaah Ta`ala knows that a certain person will do certain thing, which he (man) will be doing it of his own choice and not by any force exerted on him by Allaah Ta`ala. So if any act is to take place in the Knowledge of Allaah Ta`ala, then man’s will and intention will coincide with this Knowledge of Allaah Ta`ala and occur accordingly. Hence the belief in Taqdeer, contrary to it negating the concept of free will and choice actually confirms and strengthens it.

Book of Beliefs

[WildWolfdog]

That is predestinations that Allah knows everything from eternity. The literal meaning of Taqdeer or predestination is to plan something beforehand. Like how a person will plan a house before building it, so too did Allaah ‘plan’ this entire universe, which was always existent in His Knowledge.

If that's what we're both saying we agree with, then why are we arguing? The only thing is - when we say we believe in predestination, we know what we mean by it - but when a non-muslim hears it, they'll assume we're talking about the same predestination some Christians believe in (and that's not true).

The Knowledge of with the actions of His servants is such that it does not restrict the actions of man. The Knowledge of Allaah Ta`ala has this connection with the actions of man, that Allaah Ta`ala knows that a certain person will do certain thing, which he (man) will be doing it of his own choice and not by any force exerted on him by Allaah Ta`ala. So if any act is to take place in the Knowledge of Allaah Ta`ala, then man’s will and intention will coincide with this Knowledge of Allaah Ta`ala and occur accordingly. Hence the belief in Taqdeer, contrary to it negating the concept of free will and choice actually confirms and strengthens it.

Book of Beliefs

Lol bro, you know I have lowe and resteCp for you lol, but you gotta read what I'm writing before you paste certain sections of an article. What you posted above, that's basically what I said - though I have a feeling you didn't really read most of it, minus the first couple of lines.

[khanbaba_]

If that's what we're both saying we agree with, then why are we arguing? The only thing is - when we say we believe in predestination, we know what we mean by it - but when a non-muslim hears it, they'll assume we're talking about the same predestination some Christians believe in (and that's not true).



.
Wait do you believe that Allah knows who will enter Paradise, Hell etc from eternity, then its fine.

You said
but a lot of people confuse the fact that Allah knows everything with predestination
I dont see any contradiction?

[WildWolfdog]

Wait do you believe that Allah knows who will enter Paradise, Hell etc from eternity, then its fine.

You said

I dont see any contradiction?

Lol yeah, obviously I do believe that (bolded part). The contradiciton comes into play because of the belief of certain Christians in predestination as well, and their version of it. It's different from ours, and I assumed you were saying it's the same thing - when clearly it's not. I think we're both clear on each other's pov's now lol so there shouldn't be a problem anymore.

Christian belief (some sects) - Predestination means God chose a select few to enter Paradise (randomly btw) when he created the universe, and everyone else will go to hell.

Muslim belief - Predestination means Allah already knows what's going to happen and he knew it from the start. But that doesn't mean he has chosen out our paths for us (and voiding us of free will), it means he already knows what paths we will follow.

[khanbaba_]

Lol yeah, obviously I do believe that (bolded part). The contradiciton comes into play because of the belief of certain Christians in predestination as well, and their version of it. It's different from ours, and I assumed you were saying it's the same thing - when clearly it's not. I think we're both clear on each other's pov's now lol so there shouldn't be a problem anymore.

Christian belief (some sects) - Predestination means God chose a select few to enter Paradise (randomly btw) when he created the universe, and everyone else will go to hell.

Muslim belief - Predestination means Allah already knows what's going to happen and he knew it from the start. But that doesn't mean he has chosen out our paths for us (and voiding us of free will), it means he already knows what paths we will follow.
Allah created allactions, be it evil or good, and then gave man the choice to choose one of the two. The knowledge of Allah is perfect, everything will take place exactly according to His knowledge, but in the case of human deeds, through the choice of the individual.

Yup and misconceptions cleared. Anyways its one of mysteries of Allah. It is not fully comprehensible to the human mind not can it be fully explained, so leave it to that. =)

[KhanNoonienSingh]

Its one of the fundamental article of Imaan, and its fardh to believe in predestination.
i have no idea if this is from some sufi dude's writings or what, but i liked it:

A man came before Hazrat Ali (RA) and asked: "Is man forced
or not?” (Meaning does he have a choice in his actions or not).
Hazrat Ali told him: "Lift up your one leg!"
The man lifted his one leg up. Then he said: "Now lift up the other".
He asked: "How can both legs be lifted up?"
Hazrat Ali replied: "Well, that is the answer to your question.
Man is half forced and half free".

the half forced part being that Allah picks a lot of our lives for us, depending on what we're like. but we choose to be what we're like.

[BlingBling.bOY]

yeh it is haram 100% because your soul is still alive when your dead

so you will feel the pain if someone was to cut you up!

:neutral:
true

[BlingBling.bOY]

i agree with Hybrid, i'm a donor and I don't see anything wrong with it. there's probably nothing greater than being able to save someone's life. then again, everyone has their own opinion on the issue. my dad didn't want me to be a donor but i always think what if it was someone in my family or my close friend that needed an organ or something...
you dont control some1's death date, u cannnot change it by givin dem urr organs if they have to die they will die, and if they dont , den they will liv on there own organs, Allah has control over everything, anything possible if Allah wants, if Allah can give a abilty a women to give birth to a baby without having her engaged with a male, den anything can occure you dont need to donate your organs to save som1's life, praying for som1 is best thing, plus Allah knows urr inner feelings, :rolleyes: , dats wut i beleive, plus i dont beleive in doctors, dey jus do bulshit work, there human just like us, not god,,, they cant make u feel any better its just the stuff humans are tought these days, we use too much sceience these days...thas all sorry if said somthing wrong, appolgy in advance, no 1s perfect , these are my personal point of views...

[abu3adl]

you dont control some1's death date, u cannnot change it by givin dem urr organs if they have to die they will die, and if they dont , den they will liv on there own organs, Allah has control over everything, anything possible if Allah wants, if Allah can give a abilty a women to give birth to a baby without having her engaged with a male, den anything can occure you dont need to donate your organs to save som1's life, praying for som1 is best thing, plus Allah knows urr inner feelings, :rolleyes: , dats wut i beleive, plus i dont beleive in doctors, dey jus do bulshit work, there human just like us, not god,,, they cant make u feel any better its just the stuff humans are tought these days, we use too much sceience these days...thas all sorry if said somthing wrong, appolgy in advance, no 1s perfect , these are my personal point of views...

so i guess according to your views we should just sit on our butts and do nothing! because apparently we have no control over anything. in this case you point out death. According to your view it must be completely useless to go to a doctor bc medicine wont matter bc if its written for you to die then you will die? Please note my sarcasm and realize that this is the problems with muslims around the world today is that they dont understand the meaning and application of 8adr (qadr). The example which i will give you is that of rasoolullah (3layhe 9alaat wasalaam). Although he was well aware that when it was his time to die it would be his time, when going out into battle he would always take the proper precautions of protecting himself by wearing not one but two thick piece of chest armor. I hope that the point i am making here doesn't need further explination.

[khanbaba_]

i have no idea if this is from some sufi dude's writings or what, but i liked it:

A man came before Hazrat Ali (RA) and asked: "Is man forced
or not?” (Meaning does he have a choice in his actions or not).
Hazrat Ali told him: "Lift up your one leg!"
The man lifted his one leg up. Then he said: "Now lift up the other".
He asked: "How can both legs be lifted up?"
Hazrat Ali replied: "Well, that is the answer to your question.
Man is half forced and half free".

the half forced part being that Allah picks a lot of our lives for us, depending on what we're like. but we choose to be what we're like.
Thanks for it, I read it some where it before.

In the Hadith, Nabi s.a.w mentioned, 'There is no person from amongst you except that Allah Ta'ala has written (destined) his place in Jahannam and his place in Jannah.' They (Sahaaba) asked, 'O' Rasulullah, should we not put our trust on our books, i.e. what has been written for us. And leave out doing actions.' Nabi (Sallallaahu Alayhi Wasallam) replied, 'Carry on doing actions. Everything will be made easy for what it has been created for. As for those who are from the fortunate one's, then the actions of the fortunate one's will be made easy for him and as for those who are from the deprived one's, the actions of the deprived ones will be made easy for him.' Then, Nabi (Sallallaahu Alayhi Wasallam) recited the Aayaat, 'As for those who give (Sadaqah) and adopted God-fear, we will make smooth for him the path of ease.' (Mishkaat pg.20; Qadeemi)

[abu3adl]

Again, this isn't an Islamic forum, this is a forum where people discuss whatever. Occasionally I, or any other muslim may say or do something contrary to Islamic law...this IS NOT THE ISSUE.

This all stemmed from me stating that is is definitely haraam to donate organs to non-muslims, or to aid them in such a way when there are muslims who suffer just as much, if not more in this day and age.

and then everybody went ape-shit on me.

And your man space-cowboy wants to try and discredit my words, which are FACTS based on Qur'aan and Sunnah, by bringing up something COMPLETELY IRRELEVANT to the issue at hand. That is a BITCH MOVE. That is what people resort to when they cant win an argument.

I can sin all day and all night, but if I state that there is no God but Allah(swt) and Muhammad is his messenger, will you agree or disagree?

by: Dr Abu Bakar Abdul Majeed

The first is the principles of “choosing the lesser of two evils if neither can be avoided.” Since the saving of life is a necessity that carries more weight than preserving the integrity of the body of the donor or cadaver, and inflicting injury on the body of the donor is less evil compared with letting the patient die, therefore organ transplantation is sanctioned.

It goes without saying that the procedure should not pose any danger to the living donor as far as medically ascertainable. Here, the main principle of medical ethics, namely: primum non nocere is automatically invoked. Donation must cause no harm or a minimal increased risk to the health of the donor.

The second is the rule of “necessities overrule prohibitions.” Basically, mutilating the human body, whether living or otherwise, is against the precepts of Islam. Prophet Muhammad rebuked a man who broke the bone of a deceased which he found in a cemetery and said: “Breaking the bones of a dead man is similar to breaking the bones of a living man.”

Due respect should be accorded to the dead body as exemplified by Prophet Muhammad who stood in veneration for a funeral procession of a Jew, at a time when Jews were his companions exclaimed: “It is only a funeral of a Jew!” The Prophet answered: “Is it not a human soul?”

Nevertheless, under very special circumstances, juridical prohibitions can be waved. Allah says in the Holy Quran in Surah Al-Baqarah verse 173: “But if one is forced by necessity, without wilful disobedience, nor transgressing due limits, then he is guiltless. For Allah is Oft-Forgiving and Most Merciful.” A similar decree is stated in Surah Al-Maidah, verse 3 and Surah Al-An’am, verse 145.

Thus, Muslim jurists allow the use of non-permissible materials in medicine if it is deemed indispensable for cure and prescribed by a competent Muslim physician.

Less than eight hundred years age, Zakaria Al-Qazwini, a grand Qadhi of Iraq (A.D. 1203-1283) noticed that porcine bone graft functioned more efficiently than other xenografts. If that were the only available treatment to save the life of the patient, Muslim jurists would exonerate both the patient and surgeon from any blame.

Donating an organ is not an act of mutilation. Mutilation is done with malice and vengeance and serves no good purpose, while donation of an organ is an act of charity and benevolence as it can save a human life. In Surah Al-Maidah, verse 32, Allah says: “if anyone saves a life, it will be as if he saves the life of all mankind.”

The third principle which supports organ transplantation is contained in verse 185, Surah Al-Baqarah: “Allah intends every facility for you. He does not want to put you to difficulties.” Islam considers a disease as a natural phenomenon. However man should seek remedy, Allah, who causes ailments, also brings cure and redemption. Muslims are therefore encouraged to search for new modes of treatment and should apply them if proved successful.

A literature scan indicates that the major religions of the world do not object to organ donations. The Roman Catholic and Jewish traditions consider giving up a body part for the benefit of another as moral justifiable. While abhorring mutilation of the body, Buddhism permits donation after death if the explicit consent of the donor has been obtained before death.

[BlingBling.bOY]

so i guess according to your views we should just sit on our butts and do nothing! because apparently we have no control over anything. in this case you point out death. According to your view it must be completely useless to go to a doctor bc medicine wont matter bc if its written for you to die then you will die? Please note my sarcasm and realize that this is the problems with muslims around the world today is that they dont understand the meaning and application of 8adr (qadr). The example which i will give you is that of rasoolullah (3layhe 9alaat wasalaam). Although he was well aware that when it was his time to die it would be his time, when going out into battle he would always take the proper precautions of protecting himself by wearing not one but two thick piece of chest armor. I hope that the point i am making here doesn't need further explination.
im not sayin u shouldnt do anything, my point is doesnt matter wut u do, it will happen only wut Allah wants, a human always do somthing to protect it own self, if u think about it, u onli do wut Allah wants u to do, it said clear in da Quran how this world will change, i u sayin we are doin somthing good to make this world better place to live then are u right? or the Quran is wrong (na-aouzbi-Allah)it stated inQuran the humans will build this world with hand and wil destroy with its own hands, so yeah try makin dis world better place, wut ever u do, its written for u? doesnt matter how many prayers u do how close u r with Allah dont think u prayers will be accepted, doesnt matter who pray to Allah, Allah will accept only if he wants to.... the thing is we are trying understand this whole method of life existents, infact you probably dont even know whos ur father is (don;t be offended jus example) because u beleived the person to be urr father, a person who the world told u this is urr father, u beleived him as the father, so thing is we should serach for stuff by our self instead of always beleiving wut others have told u, because the stuff u hear from people, there human jus like u, and how com they tellin u somthing u didnt knw and they knew,,, even there human just like u, if u think u have control over urr self? when urr sick y do u go to doctor? in fact u carry urr own stomach, and still u cant set urr hunger time and eating, u will be hungry and u will get the food, wut Allah has written for u, cuz hes always lookin for u....

[khanbaba_]

Many Islamic scholars and Jurists have written on the subject of organ transplant. Over the decades, medicine has improved and advanced dramatically, taking medical technology to extreme heights.

Today, through the vast medical advancement, almost any transplant of the human body can be performed. Owing to the technological medical changes, prominent and renowned jurists of the world have carefully analysed the process of organ transplant and upon investigation made the following observations:

1. When any person's limb or organ becomes unusable and that limb or organ is needed to function in the future by a suitable replacement then the following conditions must be considered.

Use of a non-living component.

Use the limb of those animals permissible to eat and slaughtered according to the Islamic rites of slaughter.

There is almost certain fear of loss of life or danger of losing the limb/organ and the replacement is only found in Haraam animals or in permissible animals (which can be eaten) but not slaughtered according to Islamic rites, then use of such a component will be permissible. However, if there is no imminent danger of loss of life then it will not be permissible to use anything from the pig.

2. Similarly, a transplant of any nature whatsoever is permissible from one part to another part of the body of the same person when necessary.

3. The sale of any part of the human body is Haraam.

4. If any ill person reaches a stage that a specific organ becomes unusable (to such an extent) that if a human organ is not replaced into the body then there is an immediate danger of loss of life -- the human organ is the only suitable replacement and medical experts are absolutely certain that besides the human organ, there is no other life-saving substitute and the patients' life is in danger, and the human organ is easily available to the patient, then in that dire need a human organ transplant (to save one's life) will be permissible for the sick.

5. When a perfectly healthy person on the advice of an expert physician confirms that the removal of one kidney will not harm nor cause ill-health whatsoever and considering the deteriorating health of his sick immediate family member which may cause death and there is no other alternate or substitute then this will be permissible with the condition that the kidney be donated and not sold.

The bequest (Wasiyyat) of a person that after his death, his organs be donated is forbidden in Shariah.

:thumleft:

[ana]

Is that your fiance?