Glad tidings of jannat for women............

[4u2nvqt]

Glad tidings of jannat for women in the light of hadith.

ive uploaded some hadith, which shows some of the rewards a women gets for things she does in her daily life.
the image is a crap copy, yes i know! so i re-typed it for your easy reading. pass it on too.

http://i120.photobucket.com/albums/o195/jiglo98/hadith1.jpg
http://i120.photobucket.com/albums/o195/jiglo98/hadith2.jpg

BI ISMIHI TAALA
Glad tidings of jannat for women in the
light of hadith

1. a single pious, practicing women is equal to 70 saints (aulia-e-kiraam).

2. A single bad (evil) women is equal to 1000 bad men.

3. Two rakaat nammaz of an Aalimah women are better than 80 rakaat of ordinary women

4. A breast-feeding women gets one good deed for each drop of milk that is fed to the child

5. When the husband comes home full of worries and the wife extends warm welcome to him and consoles him, she receives the reward of half jihad.

6. A women who is deprived of sleep owing to her child crying at night, receives the sawaab of freeing 20 slaves.

7. When a husband and wife look at each other with love and affection, allah paak himself looks at both of them with love and affection.

8. A women who sends out her husband in the path of allah and stays at home by herself, maintaining her honour and dignity (ie. Pretecting herself against temptation and dishonesty) will enter jannat 500 years before her husband while 70,000 angels and hoors will serve her. She will be given ghusal in jannat and sitting on mountain of pearls she will await the arrival of her husband.

9. A women who is rendered restless owing to the illness of her baby and yet kept on striving to comfort the baby- allah taala forgives all her sins and gives her the sawab of 12 years accepted ibaadat.

10. While milking her animals (cow,goats, etc) if a women makes the zikar of bismillah, that very animal makes dua to allah taala on her behalf.


11. when a women makes the zikar of bismillah while preparing dough (for roti) her livelihood is increased (ie. She receives barakat in her rozi).

12. When a women makes zikar while sweeping she receives the sawaab of sweeping baitullah )ka,ba).

13. A chaste women who is mindful of namaaz and roza. And also makes kidhmat of her husband for her all the 8 doors of jannat are opened. She may enter from which ever door she likes.

14. The namaaz and ibaadat of a women disobedient to her husband do not reach the heavens.

15. Everynight of an expectant mother (a women who is carring a baby in her womb) is counted as spent in ibaadat and everyday as spent in fasting.

16. A women receives the sawaab of 70 years namaaz and roza on giving birth to one child, and the pain she suffered in every vein of her body while giving birth- for that she will received the sawaab of one hajj.

17. If a women dies within 40 days after giving birth, allah taala gives her the status of shahadat (that is she dies as a shaheed)

18. Upon the child crying at night, if the mother feeds the child (gives milk to the child) without cursing – she receives the sawaab of performing namaaz for one year and of keeping fast for one year.

19. When a child finishes the period of breast feeding an angel comes and gives glad tiding to the mother that allah has made jannat wajib for her.

20. When the husband comes home to sleep and the wife gives him food to eat (not being involved in dishonesty with regard to herself and her husbands belongings) allah taala gives her the sawaab of 12 years ibaadat.

21. When a wife presses the legs of her husband without him asking her to do so, she gets the sawaab of giving in charity 12 ounces of gold; and if she presses his legs after he asks her to do so, she receives the sawaab of giving 7 ounces of silver in sadaqa.

22. When a womens husband dies while he was happy and pleased with her, jannat becomes wajib for her.

23. A husbands teaching one masla to his wife, is equal to 80 years ibaadat

24. In jannat people will go to visit (see) allah taala, but allah taala himself will visit (to see) the women who had observed purdah while in dunya.

25. Women who wear thin (see through) garments, or who arouse passion in men, or meet men they are not allowed to mix with, or move about, openly while heavily made-up, or who live without purdah, will never enter jannat, in fact they will not even smell the fragrance of jannat.

26. A women who has undergone a great amount of suffering and difficulties in this world will be classified with hazrat asia (r.a) she was the wife of fir-aun (pharaoh) who,despite the fact that she was his wife, tortured and persecuted her, to renounce deen and iman, she gave her life in the process (ie. She died of the punishment meted out to her) but she did not forsake iman.

27. Every single women going to hell will take with her 4 jannati men, because they had no fikar nor had they cared, in dunya, about the deen and iman of that women, and did not teach her deen.
These 4 men will be

Her father
Her brother
Her husband
Her son

She will complain to allah taala that they did not tell her to read namaaz

28. If a women glances at men she is not allowed to see according to the shariah- allah taala sends his curse upon her, just as it is forbidden for a man to glance at women he is not allowed to see.

Please make copies and pass on to others.

[4u2nvqt]

sawaab=rewards
jannat=heaven
ibaadat=worship
kidhmat=offer help
roza=fast
wajib= compulsary
masla=to explain a topic
purdah=covering up,i.e scarf
dunya=world
imaan=faith
rozi=livelihood

[4u2nvqt]

#24 is the ultimate, allah swt will go visit the one who observed purdah.

[fr_london]

Mashallah

[4u2nvqt]

Mashallah

yes thats what i thought when readig it too,, few females know what reawrds are given so i thought ill upload this.

[~*ZainaB*~]

Wow..thanx alot for posting this up..Alot of them are eye openers..now im scared :(

[4u2nvqt]

Wow..thanx alot for posting this up..Alot of them are eye openers..now im scared :(


whats to be scared about,,,there are some great virtues.
things should be done slowly but continous

[TheLoneAvenger]

Good post. It's a good refresher on how compassionate/forgiving God is.

[~*ZainaB*~]

whats to be scared about,,,there are some great virtues.
things should be done slowly but continous


I duno..im young and i already feel like such a screw up :neutral:

[4u2nvqt]

Good post. It's a good refresher on how compassionate/forgiving God is.

god him self challenges any one who thinks they are more forgiving them himself.
even if the sins were like the foam on the sea,full of sins reaching from the earth to the heavens- all will be forgiven for the sincere repenter.

[LoNdOnStAnI]

Jazakallah brother, very helpful indeed, May Allah bless you in this life and the hear after, for helping others.

[4u2nvqt]

I duno..im young and i already feel like such a screw up :neutral:

read my above reply,,,

[4u2nvqt]

Jazakallah bro, very helpful indeed, May Allah bless you in this life and the hear after, for helping others.

ameen,,, just pass to other females,,as im sure it will lighten they mood up and the love for allah will increase.

[SaFiYa]

BarakAllah feek akhi :D

What is fikar? :sarb:

[4u2nvqt]

BarakAllah feek akhi :D

What is fikar? :sarb:

just quote the number, so i can read the text

[SaFiYa]

Its number 27 :)

[4u2nvqt]

Its number 27 :)


worry/concern, its the same in arabic,,,,fikar

[SaFiYa]

Okay thx akhi ;)

[4u2nvqt]

Okay thx akhi ;)
no probs

[Felonius Monk]

lol

[Cunard]

21. When a wife presses the legs of her husband without him asking her to do so, she gets the sawaab of giving in charity 12 ounces of gold; and if she presses his legs after he asks her to do so, she receives the sawaab of giving 7 ounces of silver in sadaqa.

:rofl:

[gurl_exotica]

mashallah..
such a welcome break from the nonsense on here really..

thanks..
such valuable lessons..
they teach us women that thr's reward in modesty n being humble..

[4u2nvqt]

mashallah..
such a welcome break from the nonsense on here really..

thanks..
such valuable lessons..
they teach us women that thr's reward in modesty n being humble..

absolutely

[Adnan786]

Mashallah bro. That was a nice read, i would love to end up with a woman like that lol....nearly extinct thou.

[LoNdOnStAnI]

ameen,,, just pass to other females,,as im sure it will lighten they mood up and the love for allah will increase.

inshallah i will do, its very insightful, and inshallah may many sisters on here learn from it and pass this on to others,.....its every muslims duty to share information concerning islam to others, to help them gain more knowledge and understand of islam. May Allah reward you for this, Ameen.
neway hows are ya?

[4u2nvqt]

inshallah i will do, its very insightful, and inshallah may many sisters on here will learn from it and pass this on to others,.....its every muslims duty to share information concerning islam to others, to help them gain more knowledge and understand of islam. May Allah reward you for this, Ameen.
neway hows are ya?

wow,,good to know people taking the teachings of deen serious.

yeah im cool,, i was meaning to put this up for ages but got to lazy,, still on my holidays from work,, so yay. got another 3 weeks off. how abouts you,hows london.

[gurl_exotica]

i had some questions regarding hijab..

anyone?

[w1ld]

good post brother

[4u2nvqt]

Mashallah bro. That was a nice read, i would love to end up with a woman like that lol....nearly extinct thou.


there are women like these,, but is unfortunate then when we go to seek a wife,,, we look for beauty and wealth and leave deen to the last,,only if deen came first. but yeah if a man behaves as he should then why wont he find the correct women. make dua.

[4u2nvqt]

i had some questions regarding hijab..

anyone?

muftis are the best people to seek knowledge from but,,if its a simple question then go ahead.

[4u2nvqt]

good post brother


the sig,, oh my wot can i say ;)
great balls brother

[Mz_Newyawk]

Women who wear thin (see through) garments, or who arouse passion in men, or meet men they are not allowed to mix with, or move about, openly while heavily made-up, or who live without purdah, will never enter jannat, in fact they will not even smell the fragrance of jannat.

:Oops:
:no:
im not going to janaat :tears:

[gurl_exotica]

muftis are the best people to seek knowledge from but,,if its a simple question then go ahead.
i want a neutral non-chavanist response..
thats why i dun wanna ask any mufti..

does the hijab mean covering the face too..
and some people argue that in the Quran it is only mentioned.."Oh Men Of Islam..order ur women to cover their chests..
so then does it mean that modest dressing and covering the chest is enough and covering the head and hair is not necessary?

[4u2nvqt]

Women who wear thin (see through) garments, or who arouse passion in men, or meet men they are not allowed to mix with, or move about, openly while heavily made-up, or who live without purdah, will never enter jannat, in fact they will not even smell the fragrance of jannat.

:Oops:
:no:
im not going to janaat :tears:

well,have intention to chnage your ways, and slowly make improvements,
dont think jannat a place of just sleeping in silk bedding, its a place where your heart should be crying out for.

[Cunard]

i want a neutral non-chavanist response..
thats why i dun wanna ask any mufti..

does the hijab mean covering the face too..
and some people argue that in the Quran it is only mentioned.."Oh Men Of Islam..order ur women to cover their chests..
so then does it mean that modest dressing and covering the chest is enough and covering the head and hair is not necessary?

your going out with a non muslim (unless u broke up and im behind on rd gossip).....im sure the least of your worries is a hijab :eek:

[Redxiii]

and you effin modern women cry abt equality and being subjected to men all the time... :no:

[4u2nvqt]

i want a neutral non-chavanist response..
thats why i dun wanna ask any mufti..

does the hijab mean covering the face too..
and some people argue that in the Quran it is only mentioned.."Oh Men Of Islam..order ur women to cover their chests..
so then does it mean that modest dressing and covering the chest is enough and covering the head and hair is not necessary?


there is a legal limit in which you have to cover up,, ie.

up to your ankles and up to your wrists, and only your face can be shown,meaning the neck, hair will have to be covered. its not nessecery to cover the face will a vail,but its for the women her self to decide, but the legal limits are the farz

[LoNdOnStAnI]

wow,,good to know people taking the teachings of deen serious.

yeah im cool,, i was meaning to put this up for ages but got to lazy,, still on my holidays from work,, so yay. got another 3 weeks off. how abouts you,hows london.


lol im always serious when it comes to deen, (its probly the only thing im ever serious about, :) lol,) theres nothing in this dunya thats more beautiful and important than our deed, inshallah i pray that everyone muslim or non-muslim will learn and realise this before its too late, and embrace the truth. Ameen

yeah londons alright,alhamdulillah, same as usual, although gets boring at times.

[gurl_exotica]

your going out with a non muslim (unless u broke up and im behind on rd gossip).....im sure the least of your worries is a hijab :eek:
yes u are actually quite behind RD gossip..
i have other more poignant worries now..

[khanbaba_]

thats why i dun wanna ask any mufti..


L0L, its like saying, when I am sick, I dont wana go to a doctor, inseated I will go to goldsmith. Leave the experts and ask amatuers. :rolleyes:

[gurl_exotica]

there is a legal limit in which you have to cover up,, ie.

up to your ankles and up to your wrists, and only your face can be shown,meaning the neck, hair will have to be covered. its not nessecery to cover the face will a vail,but its for the women her self to decide, but the legal limits are the farz
but covering the hair isnt mentioned in the quran..

also..in places where its boiling hot..
covering the head can be quite irksome..
surely allah could not have been so unfair so as to make it compulsory for women to cover their head n not do so for men..
am i even making sense?

[gurl_exotica]

L0L, its like saying, when I am sick, I dont wana go to a doctor, inseated I will go to goldsmith. Leave the experts and ask amatuers. :rolleyes:
i mean a male chauvanist mufti..:o

[4u2nvqt]

your going out with a non muslim (unless u broke up and im behind on rd gossip).....im sure the least of your worries is a hijab :eek:

someone who seeks knowledge doesnt mean they are all pious and not guilty of anything.
just because she might be doing somethng she shouldnt be,doesnt mean she cant go out and learn her religion. you should no better.

[4u2nvqt]

lol im always serious when it comes to deen, (its probly the only thing im ever serious about, :) lol,) theres nothing in this dunya thats more beautiful and important than our deed, inshallah i pray that everyone muslim or non-muslim will learn and realise this before its too late, and embrace the truth. Ameen

yeah londons alright,alhamdulillah, same as usual, although gets boring at times.
not as boring as bradford the greatest. lol

[khanbaba_]

i mean a male chauvanist mufti..:o
Anything he tells and and you dont like it, you will call names. :)

[ORaNGe dAsY]

someone who seeks knowledge doesnt mean they are all pious and not guilty of anything.
just because she might be doing somethng she shouldnt be,doesnt mean she cant go out and learn her religion. you should no better.
Actually, he doesn't know better. Or anything at all for that matter.

[gurl_exotica]

someone who seeks knowledge doesnt mean they are all pious and not guilty of anything.
just because she might be doing somethng she shouldnt be,doesnt mean she cant go out and learn her religion. you should no better.
thanks..:)
i'm trying to correct myself and my life now..
one small step at a time..
closer to Allah..

[4u2nvqt]

L0L, its like saying, when I am sick, I dont wana go to a doctor, inseated I will go to goldsmith. Leave the experts and ask amatuers. :rolleyes:

so true

[gurl_exotica]

Anything he tells and and you dont like it, you will call names. :)
there is no harm in consulting ppl with different point of views and interpretations right?

[khanbaba_]

there is no harm in consulting ppl with different point of views and interpretations right?
Sometimes theres only 1 view that is correct, something that are very clear and no difference.

[*BabyGirl*]

:rolleyes: ...jeez!

[Felonius Monk]

Sometimes theres only 1 view that is correct, something that are very clear and no difference.
The hijab is not one of them. It was a legit question.

[4u2nvqt]

but covering the hair isnt mentioned in the quran..

also..in places where its boiling hot..
covering the head can be quite irksome..
surely allah could not have been so unfair so as to make it compulsory for women to cover their head n not do so for men..
am i even making sense?


nor is it mentioned in the quran about the dajal,
you will have to speak to a mufti one whch you are happy to speak to,,im sure there are a few around your area,,if not im sure askimam.com will be of great help. lol.

we do cover our head.
.

[gurl_exotica]

Sometimes theres only 1 view that is correct, something that are very clear and no difference.
hijab certainly isnt one of them..

[khanbaba_]

The hijab is not one of them. It was a legit question.
Sorry but it is one of them.

[gurl_exotica]

The hijab is not one of them. It was a legit question.
co-signed

[Cunard]

someone who seeks knowledge doesnt mean they are all pious and not guilty of anything.
just because she might be doing somethng she shouldnt be,doesnt mean she cant go out and learn her religion. you should no better.

oh i do know better brother...hence why i dont buy into the nonsense you posted up


21. When a wife presses the legs of her husband without him asking her to do so, she gets the sawaab of giving in charity 12 ounces of gold; and if she presses his legs after he asks her to do so, she receives the sawaab of giving 7 ounces of silver in sadaqa.

like come on....are u fucking kidding me with this stuff^ ?

would be interesting to see the list for men...cause so far this list is clearly written by men to make life easier for them...and they do so by pulling out the religion card :p

[4u2nvqt]

co-signed

shall we just buzz of the quotes i had posted and leave the hijab discussions with the muftis,

[gurl_exotica]

nor is it mentioned in the quran about the dajal,
you will have to speak to a mufti one whch you are happy to speak to,,im sure there are a few around your area,,if not im sure askimam.com will be of great help. lol.

we do cover our head.
but its not compulsory for men is it?
whereas according to majority of interpretations it is compusory for women..

but then again..
perhaps..life a wee bit more difficult for women in this world..
but the rewards in the after life are great? :)

[Felonius Monk]

Sorry but it is one of them.
Sorry, but the vast majority of the Islamic world doesnt believe so.

[gurl_exotica]

oh i do know better brother...hence why i dont buy into the nonsense you posted up


21. When a wife presses the legs of her husband without him asking her to do so, she gets the sawaab of giving in charity 12 ounces of gold; and if she presses his legs after he asks her to do so, she receives the sawaab of giving 7 ounces of silver in sadaqa.

like come on....are u fucking kidding me with this stuff^ ?

would be interesting to see the list for men...cause so far this list is clearly written by men to make life easier for them...and they do so by pulling out the religion card :p
yeap..
i agree..
there has to be a similar list for men..

[gurl_exotica]

shall we just buzz of the quotes i had posted and leave the hijab discussions with the muftis,
sorry..:ashamed:

[*BabyGirl*]

yeap..
i agree..
there has to be a similar list for men..

post it up.. I'm curious :sarb: I might even convert! :rolleyes:

[khanbaba_]

Sorry, but the vast majority of the Islamic world doesnt believe so.
Opinion of the laymen doesnt matter. If majority of the Muslim world stop praying 5 times, it doesnt mean they dont think of prayers as something obligatory. If majority of the women dont cover, that doesnt mean its not compulsory to cover.

[4u2nvqt]

oh i do know better brother...hence why i dont buy into the nonsense you posted up


21. When a wife presses the legs of her husband without him asking her to do so, she gets the sawaab of giving in charity 12 ounces of gold; and if she presses his legs after he asks her to do so, she receives the sawaab of giving 7 ounces of silver in sadaqa.

like come on....are u fucking kidding me with this stuff^ ?

would be interesting to see the list for men...cause so far this list is clearly written by men to make life easier for them...and they do so by pulling out the religion card :p

kufar will always be in darkness with islam,
a women can press his husbands legs,, and they aint nothing wrong with dat, just because you might have a problem with it doesnt mean the whole world is agianst it,its as those its a compulsary for the women to do it, if you dont like it,, LEAVE. you corrupt mandar

[gurl_exotica]

post it up.. I'm curious :sarb: I might even convert! :rolleyes:
i wish i knew the nitty gritties..
sadly religion is in the exclusive control of men..
u'll see thousands of lists on what is expected of women..but none about men..

[Cunard]

yeap..
i agree..
there has to be a similar list for men..

i would hope so...cause otherwise its pretty clear that the rules are made by men to farther themselves in life by making things easier for themselves...at the expense of somone else...and they do this by playing the religion card


i can just see some guy going "honey if you dont massage my legs your not gonna make it to paradise" :p

[gurl_exotica]

Opinion of the laymen doesnt matter. If majority of the Muslim world stop praying 5 times, it doesnt mean they dont think of prayers as something obligatory. If majority of the women dont cover, that doesnt mean its not compulsory to cover.
my question was not about covering up..
what i asked was the extent to which it was mandatory for women to cover up..

dressing modestly..and modesty in behaviour i agree..
but covering the head and such..debatable..

[Cunard]

kufar will always be in darkness with islam,
a women can press his husbands legs,, and they aint nothing wrong with dat, just because you might have a problem with it doesnt mean the whole world is agianst it, if you dont like it,, LEAVE. you corrupt mandar

:rofl:

there is nothing wrong with a women massaging her husband.....but does it equal 12 onces of gold to a charity with a religious twist to it? not a fucking chance

like i said before..post up the list for men....if there is even one

[DasJa]

i wish i knew the nitty gritties..
sadly religion is in the exclusive control of men..
u'll see thousands of lists on what is expected of women..but none about men..
I JUST DISCOVERED IT :Peace:

1) To tell a woman to keep quite is perfectly understandable. All talk talk all the time these women I tell ya
2) Men should only shop in the car departments and the wood-working section. Anything other than these 2, are solely women's area of expertise..and should be left ALONE.
3)Kheema samosa's rock!

There ya go muz.... ;)

[Felonius Monk]

Opinion of the laymen doesnt matter. If majority of the Muslim world stop praying 5 times, it doesnt mean they dont think of prayers as something obligatory. If majority of the women dont cover, that doesnt mean its not compulsory to cover.
Its not the opinion of laymen. Its the opinion of scholars. Apart from an injunction to dress modestly and cover certain areas, the Quran doesnt specify exactly what form the garment has to take. If you think the hijab is compulsory, please provide proof.

[4u2nvqt]

sorry,, i dont have one for the men,,, lol,, i try getting one. this post was just for women. and lets not get into an argument about the hijab,,so relax all you shaikh-el- hadiths

[khanbaba_]

my question was not about covering up..
what i asked was the extent to which it was mandatory for women to cover up..

dressing modestly..and modesty in behaviour i agree..
but covering the head and such..debatable..
Its not debatable. There is Ijma on it. Laws are clear. But people who dont want to cover, they will come up with all kind of excuses.

[LoNdOnStAnI]

not as boring as bradford the greatest. lol


:rofl: we both know thats not true, ;) oh i aint been there in ages :neutral: ........ and i cant believe im saying this.... but...... i wouldnt mind going up north since i cant remember when was the last time i went, to see me cuz :sarb: :neutral:


but yeah london is the best, nothing can beat it :kekeke:

[Cunard]

I JUST DISCOVERED IT :Peace:

1) To tell a woman to keep quite is perfectly understandable. All talk talk all the time these women I tell ya
2) Men should only shop in the car departments and the wood-working section. Anything other than these 2, are solely women's area of expertise..and should be left ALONE.
3)Kheema samosa's rock!

There ya go muz.... ;)

:werd:

[gurl_exotica]

i would hope so...cause otherwise its pretty clear that the rules are made by men to farther themselves in life by making things easier for themselves...at the expense of somone else...and they do this by playing the religion card


i can just see some guy going "honey if you dont massage my legs your not gonna make it to paradise" :p
i know right..lol
like i said..
all major religions..are in/under the exclusive control of men..
and till that remains we'll never be able to see true islam..

for i stronly believe that islam is a religion of equality among genders..
but most of the male muftis just make it sound like islam glorifies the MAN and degrades the WOMAN

[khanbaba_]

Its not the opinion of laymen. Its the opinion of scholars. Apart from an injunction to dress modestly and cover certain areas, the Quran doesnt specify exactly what form the garment has to take. If you think the hijab is compulsory, please provide proof.
First of all tehre are 4 sources of Sharia and if something is proven from anyone of them, it becomes the law. Quran, Sunnah, Ijma (consensus) analogy. There was no difference about this among the Sahabas, and the early Muslims untill the 14th century. So if these half baked scholars come up with new rules, they dont hold any water.

[gurl_exotica]

I JUST DISCOVERED IT :Peace:

1) To tell a woman to keep quite is perfectly understandable. All talk talk all the time these women I tell ya
2) Men should only shop in the car departments and the wood-working section. Anything other than these 2, are solely women's area of expertise..and should be left ALONE.
3)Kheema samosa's rock!

There ya go muz.... ;)
i know i can always count on u..lol..:lol:

go make me some keema samosas now..

[4u2nvqt]

:rofl:

there is nothing wrong with a women massaging her husband.....but does it equal 12 onces of gold to a charity with a religious twist to it? not a fucking chance

like i said before..post up the list for men....if there is even one

cunard your a funny shit,,, its just the reward that she will recieve dats all,,the reward she would have got for giving the gold in charity.

i dont have the list for the man,,sorry ppls,,ill try to locate it, but with a slim chance for success

[gurl_exotica]

First of all tehre are 4 sources of Sharia and if something is proven from anyone of them, it becomes the law. Quran, Sunnah, Ijma (consensus) analogy. There was no difference about this among the Sahabas, and the early Muslims untill the 14th century. So if these half baked scholars come up with new rules, they dont hold any water.

are women a part of the group that arrives on a consensus?
are the represented fairly in this consesnsus making?

[4u2nvqt]

i know i can always count on u..lol..:lol:

go make me some keema samosas now..


i vant some now too..and keema rolls in pastry of course

[DasJa]

i know i can always count on u..lol..:lol:

go make me some keema samosas now..
Get ur butt to work woman. And some chai with the samosa's.... :Paper:

[Cunard]

i know right..lol
like i said..
all major religions..are in/under the exclusive control of men..
and till that remains we'll never be able to see true islam..

for i stronly believe that islam is a religion of equality among genders..
but most of the male muftis just make it sound like islam glorifies the MAN and degrades the WOMAN

a while back the highest religious seat of sikhs was controled by a women called Bibi Kaur.....but she wasnt really the face of perfection either....she was just as much into the politics as her male counterparts :p


religion these days is close minded and has little place in our open societies...other then the spiritual aspect of it, most religious laws and practices are outdated and need to be brought up to speed...till then live your life morally....is god really gonna close the door on you cause you didnt wear a hijab or loved someone of a different faith.....i highly doubt it...im sure he (or she) is probably more interested in how u lived your life overall such as being a good world citizen

[gurl_exotica]

Get ur butt to work woman. And some chai with the samosa's.... :Paper:
:hand:
say please..
a box of chocolates n then try again..
i vant some now too..and keema rolls in pastry of course

das ja is taking orders..
he's our master chef in disguise..:cool:

[khanbaba_]

are women a part of the group that arrives on a consensus?
are the represented fairly in this consesnsus making?
There were Sahabia Mufits such as Hazrat Aisha r.a. She was the teacher of many Sahabas.
2nd, are you going to question why there are no women Prophets saw?
If something was clearly said by Prophet s.a.w, there is no need to aruge over it.

[Cunard]

cunard your a funny shit,,, its just the reward that she will recieve dats all,,the reward she would have got for giving the gold in charity.

i dont have the list for the man,,sorry ppls,,ill try to locate it, but with a slim chance for success

how do you even compare the two....12 onces of gold to a charity vs a 15 min massage of her mans legs....this is clearly just used to manipulate the avg women with zero education into doing every whim or fancy her husband desires....and to push the issue even farther the threat of religious law is used to enforce such ideas

as for not being able to find a list for men...surprise surprise eh :p

[4u2nvqt]

:rofl: we both know thats not true, ;) oh i aint been there in ages :neutral: ........ and i cant believe im saying this.... but...... i wouldnt mind going up north since i cant remember when was the last time i went, to see me cuz :sarb: :neutral:


but yeah london is the best, nothing can beat it :kekeke:




wots going on int his thread,,,yeah come up just embrace your self with bordom unless your into 2pac and weed and guns and samosas lol

[Felonius Monk]

First of all tehre are 4 sources of Sharia and if something is proven from anyone of them, it becomes the law. Quran, Sunnah, Ijma (consensus) analogy. There was no difference about this among the Sahabas, and the early Muslims untill the 14th century. So if these half baked scholars come up with new rules, they dont hold any water.
Apart from the Quran, none of the others are absolute or intended to hold for all time. They are by definition interpreted by scholars. You can choose to accept the old rules, but to say the old rules are absolute and cannot be changed is patently false. Only the Quran is absolute to muslims, and the Quran doesnt have a definitive answer on the hijab.

One of the hadith listed here says purdah is mandatory to go to heaven. Why isnt it a law then?

[DasJa]

a while back the highest religious seat of sikhs was controled by a women called Bibi Kaur.....but she wasnt really the face of perfection either....she was just as much into the politics as her male counterparts :p


religion these days is close minded and has little place in our open societies...other then the spiritual aspect of it, most religious laws and practices are outdated and need to be brought up to speed...till then live your life morally....is god really gonna close the door on you cause you didnt wear a hijab or loved someone of a different faith.....i highly doubt it...im sure he (or she) is probably more interested in how u lived your life overall such as being a good world citizen
:werd:
My belief's exactly. There are ppl who pray 5 times a day, but commit sin's and bribery under God's name. And then there are muslims who dont pray 5 times a day (maybe 1-2) but are always wiling to help a poor man/woman....and work an honest living. Who do you thinks going to heaven?
Exactly! It's not how many times you take gods name that matters...but HOW you take it...whether once-twice with a clean and pure heart...or 5 times a day, but with a heart filled with greed and treachery.

[gurl_exotica]

a while back the highest religious seat of sikhs was controled by a women called Bibi Kaur.....but she wasnt really the face of perfection either....she was just as much into the politics as her male counterparts :p


religion these days is close minded and has little place in our open societies...other then the spiritual aspect of it, most religious laws and practices are outdated and need to be brought up to speed...till then live your life morally....is god really gonna close the door on you cause you didnt wear a hijab or loved someone of a different faith.....i highly doubt it...im sure he (or she) is probably more interested in how u lived your life overall such as being a good world citizen

i agree with u partly..
there are some rules that one ought to follow..
being a good human being is imperative to being a religious person..
i see ppl who're staunchly religious..namaaz, puja etc and then go about life doing every inhuman deed..
thats not what religion is..
and every faith has scope for every individual to seek the truth..
blindly following interpretations is foolishness to say the least..

[Cunard]

:werd:
My belief's exactly. There are ppl who pray 5 times a day, but commit sin's and bribery under God's name. And then there are muslims who dont pray 5 times a day (maybe 1-2) but are always wiling to help a poor man/woman....and work an honest living. Who do you thinks going to heaven?
Exactly! It's not how many times you take gods name that matters...but HOW you take it...whether once-twice with a clean and pure heart...or 5 times a day, but with a heart filled with greed and treachery.

and i love money :ashamed:

[DasJa]

and i love money :ashamed:
U's going down boy :p

[khanbaba_]

Apart from the Quran, none of the others are absolute or intended to hold for all time. They are by definition interpreted by scholars. You can choose to accept the old rules, but to say the old rules are absolute and cannot be changed is patently false. Only the Quran is absolute to muslims, and the Quran doesnt have a definitive answer on the hijab.

One of the hadith listed here says purdah is mandatory to go to heaven. Why isnt it a law then?
For Muslims, all 4 are mandaorty, and to deny Sunnah and Ijma takes you outside the fold of Islam because they are proven from the Quran itself. If you say only Quran is absolute, you cant even pray because all the rules are not mentioned in the Quran.

[gurl_exotica]

:werd:
My belief's exactly. There are ppl who pray 5 times a day, but commit sin's and bribery under God's name. And then there are muslims who dont pray 5 times a day (maybe 1-2) but are always wiling to help a poor man/woman....and work an honest living. Who do you thinks going to heaven?
Exactly! It's not how many times you take gods name that matters...but HOW you take it...whether once-twice with a clean and pure heart...or 5 times a day, but with a heart filled with greed and treachery.
kitna achha baccha hai..:D

:kekeke:

[4u2nvqt]

how do you even compare the two....12 onces of gold to a charity vs a 15 min massage of her mans legs....this is clearly just used to manipulate the avg women with zero education into doing every whim or fancy her husband desires....and to push the issue even farther the threat of religious law is used to enforce such ideas

as for not being able to find a list for men...surprise surprise eh :p

its not compulsary for women to do the above, its just the virtue given,,by the way the first post was about the women and her general everyday burdans,, its got nothing to do with man or pleasing him, there a few quotes on this and the rest about her (women).

im sure there is one on man, there are books upon books of virtues, so let me see what i can do. if you really want the mans side to this too.

[*BabyGirl*]

i would hope so...cause otherwise its pretty clear that the rules are made by men to farther themselves in life by making things easier for themselves...at the expense of somone else...and they do this by playing the religion card


i can just see some guy going "honey if you dont massage my legs your not gonna make it to paradise" :p


sounds abit like hinduism - sati being one of the examples.

[gurl_exotica]

There were Sahabia Mufits such as Hazrat Aisha r.a. She was the teacher of many Sahabas.
2nd, are you going to question why there are no women Prophets saw?
If something was clearly said by Prophet s.a.w, there is no need to aruge over it.
u said ijma means consensus..
it is obvious that the process of arriving ar a consensus only started after prophet muhammeed SAWS's death because before that Allah sent instructions himself..

so now..after Prophet Muhammed SAWS's death..
when ijma or a consensus was formed..
the group that formed a consensus..
especially on matters related to women..
were there as many women in that group as men coz women form 50% of the population..

[4u2nvqt]

:werd:
My belief's exactly. There are ppl who pray 5 times a day, but commit sin's and bribery under God's name. And then there are muslims who dont pray 5 times a day (maybe 1-2) but are always wiling to help a poor man/woman....and work an honest living. Who do you thinks going to heaven?
Exactly! It's not how many times you take gods name that matters...but HOW you take it...whether once-twice with a clean and pure heart...or 5 times a day, but with a heart filled with greed and treachery.


well your making it out as those the ppl who pray 5 times a day are the above, why not people who pray 5times a day and bahave even better then the ones mentioned above, who do you think will go to heaven then???

the normal average folk or the 5 times prayer with a heart clear then the diamond.

[Space-Cowboy]

I JUST DISCOVERED IT :Peace:

1) To tell a woman to keep quite is perfectly understandable. All talk talk all the time these women I tell ya
2) Men should only shop in the car departments and the wood-working section. Anything other than these 2, are solely women's area of expertise..and should be left ALONE.
3)Kheema samosa's rock!

There ya go muz.... ;)

:rofl:












mee sowwie :Oops:

[Felonius Monk]

For Muslims, all 4 are mandaorty, and to deny Sunnah and Ijma takes you outside the fold of Islam because they are proven from the Quran itself. If you say only Quran is absolute, you cant even pray because all the rules are not mentioned in the Quran.
I didnt say all Sunnah and Ijma are to be rejected. Just that they, unlike the Quran, are subject to the interpretations of scholars. Scholars are unanimous on some topics while differ on others. You are stating an absolute position on a topic that they differ on.

[khanbaba_]

u said ijma means consensus..
it is obvious that the process of arriving ar a consensus only started after prophet muhammeed SAWS's death because before that Allah sent instructions himself..

so now..after Prophet Muhammed SAWS's death..
when ijma or a consensus was formed..
the group that formed a consensus..
especially on matters related to women..
were there as many women in that group as men coz women form 50% of the population..
Consensus doesnt mean there have to be 50% 50% proportion. There is Ijma of Sahabas and its wajib to follow that. Also Prophet s.a.w said the consensus of my Ummah cant gather on falsehood and anyone who oppose the Ijma can make his place in hell-fire.

You didnt asnwer me about why there are no female Prophet s.a.w? Are you going to say that Allah was unfair in only sending male Prophets s.a.w?

[gurl_exotica]

well your making it out as those the ppl who pray 5 times a day are the above, why not people who pray 5times a day and bahave even better then the ones mentioned above, who do you think will go to heaven then???

the normal average folk or the 5 times prayer with a heart clear then the diamond.
isnt it obvious..?

what he asked was a man who prayed 5 times a day but with an impure heart..
but on the other hand thr's a man who prays say 2-3 times a day but his heart is pure..

the other option wasnt even thr..

[khanbaba_]

I didnt say all Sunnah and Ijma are to be rejected. Just that they, unlike the Quran, are subject to the interpretations of scholars. Scholars are unanimous on some topics while differ on others. You are stating an absolute position on a topic that they differ on.

When there is Ijma on something, the you cant differ with it, because Ijma cant gather on falsehood. Also before Ijma there is Sunnah, and there are clear cut hadees on that.

Also Ijma doesnt mean that all 100% agree on something, that is impossible. If few scholars disagreed, then their opinion will be disgarded.

[4u2nvqt]

isnt it obvious..?

what he asked was a man who prayed 5 times a day but with an impure heart..
but on the other hand thr's a man who prays say 2-3 times a day but his heart is pure..

the other option wasnt even thr..



ok,,

whats all this got to do with what i originally posted..

[Space-Cowboy]

a while back the highest religious seat of sikhs was controled by a women called Bibi Kaur.....but she wasnt really the face of perfection either....she was just as much into the politics as her male counterparts :p


religion these days is close minded and has little place in our open societies...other then the spiritual aspect of it, most religious laws and practices are outdated and need to be brought up to speed...till then live your life morally....is god really gonna close the door on you cause you didnt wear a hijab or loved someone of a different faith.....i highly doubt it...im sure he (or she) is probably more interested in how u lived your life overall such as being a good world citizen


I think interfaith marriages should be promoted!
There's tons of inter marriages between Hindus, Sikhs, Jains and Buddhists... :D:D


[yea yea, I know what you're gonna say, but Hindus-Sikh marriages happen all the time, and the kids turn out quite fine and normal, so I really don't see why one should have an issue...... :dunno: same goes for the other two as well...]

[4u2nvqt]

has everyone calmed down,,and why aint you made the samosas,,,

[Space-Cowboy]

sounds abit like hinduism - sati being one of the examples.


Sati has no Hindu basis to it....... it was banned ages ago from Hindu practice.

[LoNdOnStAnI]

wots going on int his thread,,,yeah come up just embrace your self with bordom unless your into 2pac and weed and guns and samosas lol


i aint read all of this thread, why whats happend?

lol i was only messing wiv ya before as usual,... so it still aint changed from what your saying, :o thats a real shame, but i thought places like blackburn which is up north were becoming more religious and more aware of islam, maybe its how the media have protrayed these places, you know with the whole veil business. :sarb: inshallah they become more knowledgeable in islam and stop with the gangster act, :neutral:

[gurl_exotica]

Consensus doesnt mean there have to be 50% 50% proportion. There is Ijma of Sahabas and its wajib to follow that. Also Prophet s.a.w said the consensus of my Ummah cant gather on falsehood and anyone who oppose the Ijma can make his place in hell-fire.

You didnt asnwer me about why there are no female Prophet s.a.w? Are you going to say that Allah was unfair in only sending male Prophets s.a.w?

there are no male prophets because allah has explicitly stated in the quran that whenever people went on the wrong path i sent a prophet to show them the way of truth..
a prophet of Allah had to face a lot of hostility and physical and mental torture for he was the proponent of a way of life drastically different from what the people of that time wer accustomed to..
the shaitan thus pushed ppl towards harming these prophets who were messengers of peace and righteousness..
Allah did not see it fit to put women thru that physical pain for it is proven than women are less capable of enduring it..

allah has given a woman a very high honour by making her capable of bearing children..

and a fair consensus can only be one where the group who's interest is being discussed is represented fairly..
END Of

[4u2nvqt]

BI ISMIHI TAALA
Glad tidings of jannat for women in the
light of hadith

1. a single pious, practicing women is equal to 70 saints (aulia-e-kiraam).

2. A single bad (evil) women is equal to 1000 bad men.

3. Two rakaat nammaz of an Aalimah women are better than 80 rakaat of ordinary women

4. A breast-feeding women gets one good deed for each drop of milk that is fed to the child

5. When the husband comes home full of worries and the wife extends warm welcome to him and consoles him, she receives the reward of half jihad.

6. A women who is deprived of sleep owing to her child crying at night, receives the sawaab of freeing 20 slaves.

7. When a husband and wife look at each other with love and affection, allah paak himself looks at both of them with love and affection.

8. A women who sends out her husband in the path of allah and stays at home by herself, maintaining her honour and dignity (ie. Pretecting herself against temptation and dishonesty) will enter jannat 500 years before her husband while 70,000 angels and hoors will serve her. She will be given ghusal in jannat and sitting on mountain of pearls she will await the arrival of her husband.

9. A women who is rendered restless owing to the illness of her baby and yet kept on striving to comfort the baby- allah taala forgives all her sins and gives her the sawab of 12 years accepted ibaadat.

10. While milking her animals (cow,goats, etc) if a women makes the zikar of bismillah, that very animal makes dua to allah taala on her behalf.


11. when a women makes the zikar of bismillah while preparing dough (for roti) her livelihood is increased (ie. She receives barakat in her rozi).

12. When a women makes zikar while sweeping she receives the sawaab of sweeping baitullah )ka,ba).

13. A chaste women who is mindful of namaaz and roza. And also makes kidhmat of her husband for her all the 8 doors of jannat are opened. She may enter from which ever door she likes.

14. The namaaz and ibaadat of a women disobedient to her husband do not reach the heavens.

15. Everynight of an expectant mother (a women who is carring a baby in her womb) is counted as spent in ibaadat and everyday as spent in fasting.

16. A women receives the sawaab of 70 years namaaz and roza on giving birth to one child, and the pain she suffered in every vein of her body while giving birth- for that she will received the sawaab of one hajj.

17. If a women dies within 40 days after giving birth, allah taala gives her the status of shahadat (that is she dies as a shaheed)

18. Upon the child crying at night, if the mother feeds the child (gives milk to the child) without cursing – she receives the sawaab of performing namaaz for one year and of keeping fast for one year.

19. When a child finishes the period of breast feeding an angel comes and gives glad tiding to the mother that allah has made jannat wajib for her.

20. When the husband comes home to sleep and the wife gives him food to eat (not being involved in dishonesty with regard to herself and her husbands belongings) allah taala gives her the sawaab of 12 years ibaadat.

21. When a wife presses the legs of her husband without him asking her to do so, she gets the sawaab of giving in charity 12 ounces of gold; and if she presses his legs after he asks her to do so, she receives the sawaab of giving 7 ounces of silver in sadaqa.

22. When a womens husband dies while he was happy and pleased with her, jannat becomes wajib for her.

23. A husbands teaching one masla to his wife, is equal to 80 years ibaadat

24. In jannat people will go to visit (see) allah taala, but allah taala himself will visit (to see) the women who had observed purdah while in dunya.

25. Women who wear thin (see through) garments, or who arouse passion in men, or meet men they are not allowed to mix with, or move about, openly while heavily made-up, or who live without purdah, will never enter jannat, in fact they will not even smell the fragrance of jannat.

26. A women who has undergone a great amount of suffering and difficulties in this world will be classified with hazrat asia (r.a) she was the wife of fir-aun (pharaoh) who,despite the fact that she was his wife, tortured and persecuted her, to renounce deen and iman, she gave her life in the process (ie. She died of the punishment meted out to her) but she did not forsake iman.

27. Every single women going to hell will take with her 4 jannati men, because they had no fikar nor had they cared, in dunya, about the deen and iman of that women, and did not teach her deen.
These 4 men will be

Her father
Her brother
Her husband
Her son

She will complain to allah taala that they did not tell her to read namaaz

28. If a women glances at men she is not allowed to see according to the shariah- allah taala sends his curse upon her, just as it is forbidden for a man to glance at women he is not allowed to see.

Please make copies and pass on to others.

[gurl_exotica]

has everyone calmed down,,and why aint you made the samosas,,,
DasJa's gone to buy some keema..
someone tell him..ONLY HALAL

[Felonius Monk]

When there is Ijma on something, the you cant differ with it, because Ijma cant gather on falsehood. Also before Ijma there is Sunnah, and there are clear cut hadees on that.

Also Ijma doesnt mean that all 100% agree on something, that is impossible. If few scholars disagreed, then their opinion will be disgarded.
Sp provide evidence that there is consensus on the form of a hijab then.

[gurl_exotica]

ok,,

whats all this got to do with what i originally posted.
not explicitly but it does relate to what u posted..
in some ways..

[khanbaba_]

Its common sense that there are no *equal* rights, Allah has granted each gender their rights, men their rights and women their rights and not all those rights are common to both genders. Allah created them for different roles and if that was not the case Allah could have just created one of them. Every action of His has Divine Wisdom behind it. In Islam there is seperation of rights and not so called *equality of rights*.

[4u2nvqt]

i aint read all of this thread, why whats happend?

lol i was only messing wiv ya before as usual,... so it still aint changed from what your saying, :o thats a real shame, but i thought places like blackburn which is up north were becoming more religious and more aware of islam, maybe its how the media have protrayed these places, you know with the whole veil business. :sarb: inshallah they become more knowledgeable in islam and stop with the gangster act, :neutral:


up north i must say have all taken deen serious, people have been making alot of effort. yeah in blackburn,preston, bolton etc....its good to see this. i was just making a joke of bradford,,as everyone tends to see bradford as all gansters dats all.

[gurl_exotica]

Also Prophet s.a.w said the consensus of my Ummah cant gather on falsehood and anyone who oppose the Ijma can make his place in hell-fire.

?

the prophet also said in his last sermon that "Today Islam is complete..
there shall be, henceforth, no additions nor shall anything be deleted from my teachings..
so then..what i'm saying is that the must've, in his life, cleared out the question pertaining to the Hijab..
Where does the concept of ijma arise then?

[khanbaba_]

and a fair consensus can only be one where the group who's interest is being discussed is represented fairly..
END Of


So when Prophet s.a.w gave any order, did he consult all the women present? Or by that way did Prophet s.a.w even consulted 1 women, there was Shura of Muslims that Prophet would consult, were any women present in there?

[khanbaba_]

Sp provide evidence that there is consensus on the form of a hijab then.
Ijma of Sahabas and 4 schools of thought.

[4u2nvqt]

DasJa's gone to buy some keema..
someone tell him..ONLY HALAL

lol,,,ahahahahahhahaa,,,

[gurl_exotica]

So when Prophet s.a.w gave any order, did he consult all the women present? Or by that way did Prophet s.a.w even consulted 1 women, there was Shura of Muslims that Prophet would consult, were any women present in there?

i'm not even questioning what the Prophet said..
i'm questioning your so called Ijma on the question of Hijab..

What the prophet said were orders from allah..
i am no one to question that..

but i can surely ask for proof about the scholars' intepretation of the hijab

[KhanNoonienSingh]

in Sunni Islam, there are four schools of thought. Shafi, Hanbali, Maliki, and Hanafi. you can find out more about them on Wikipedia.

if you don't follow these four madhabs, but claim to be a Sunni, you're probably a Salafi or Wahabi (a.k.a. terrorist). those guys are fanatical and beat women into wearing entire burqas anyway so there's no real alternative. the four major schools of thought were the most liberal with regards to fiqh (law).

the veil can be considered in two types. Hijab (covering hair) and Niqab (leaving only eyes uncovered, ninja style).

Shafi, Maliki, and Hanbali madhabs have Niqab as Fardh (a.k.a. compulsory) with a minority of scholars dissenting and claiming Niqab as only Wajib. Wajib means it's not fardh but is strongly encouraged and should be treated as such, the reasons for which are mostly institutional... to foster the culture of wearing it. The reason things get called wajib and not fardh is so that they DON'T get codified into law (meaning you don't go around penalizing women for not wearing Niqab, but at the same time the culture of wearing the veil is established in society). they all agree Hijab is fardh.

Hanafi has Niqab as only wajib but Hijab is fardh (most Sunnis).

Shi'a Muslims follow Jafari madhab and I dunno their stance on Niqab but they do believe hijab at least is fardh.

Hijab (covering of hair) is agreed to be fardh by a clear majority of Muslims (for instance, if you call yourself a Sunni or Shi'ite, you're agreeing it's fardh). whether or not people practice it is a different story.

The Niqab-type veiling came about because the Qur'anic verse talking about women covering up used a word (plural of jilbaab) which can be interpreted as 'sheet' by someone who sucks at Arabic or the actual thing called a jilbaab which was a complete body covering (face too) at the time. And that all the hadith indicate women at the time veiled up to their eyes after this injunction. Niqab was the de facto standard way most Muslim women dressed during Prophet Muhammad(saw)'s time and for at least a thousand years afterwards throughout the various caliphates/empires/states.

Enforcement of Law:

don't listen to the Salafi/Wahabi wackos. the 'enforcement' of islamic law is to be done by an islamic government. a religious and political authority. it doesn't work like in Pakistan where they just haphazardly throw up laws (like the Hudood laws) that don't even conform to the religious standard (they say they are Hanafi-based but they have little in common with Imam Abu Hanifa's intepretation). there is no accountability in Pakistan's system.

as for 'hijab law', it's like traffic law. do cops fine every single person speeding even 1 mph over the limit at all times/places? no. they enforce strategically in order to foster the culture of obeying traffic law and driving safely. same would go for hijab. if there were a religious and political authority governing muslims based on shariah, the most they could do would be something like fine women or something similar if a large part of the population in a certain area were not wearing hijab (no action can be taken to enforce niqab). in fact, some modern scholars say Niqab should not be worn in Western countries in order to avoid persecution but they don't order it beyond recommending against it.

anyway, in the absencs of aforementioned government-type enforcement, nobody can enforce this on a woman. it's her choice. i'm not a scholar, but i personally don't go around ordering chicks to wear hijab aside from a general recommendation maybe cuz i think that might be forbidden in and of itself. only a woman's family or a government that she has pledged allegiance (baiyah) to can tell her to do anything. if she's not your wife, daughter, mother, sister, whatever and she didn't give you her allegiance (i.e, vote for you), then it's none of your damn business. you could try to educate her community or something so her family could then be made aware or something. islam's supposed to protect women from male idiots and give them the right to not have to put up with their bullshit, from all sectors, because it knows you can't write law assuming to trust people's intentions when it comes to another person's security.

why listen to these Imams? (Hanafi/Shafi/Maliki/Hanbali/Jafari)

because if we literally interpreted Islam in a historical context, then that would probably be interpreted as Niqab being fardh on everyone because that was the behaviour during Prophet(saw)'s time. these guys were really liberal and established an understanding of the law that allowed cultural context to be a factor. back then, nobody cared if Niqab was wajib or not, they assumed it to be fardh but these guys made sure to make clear distinctions on it and other issues. stuff that comes in handy now. they used Ijtihad for this, and we don't have that luxury anymore because there is no organized institution of scholarship in Islam overall anymore, just factions. there's no central authority either. guys like Al-Ghazali who is revered as a scholar helped shut the door on that period (when people could liberally make up their own interpretations pretty much) when they saw the state of affairs of the people and scholars was spiralling out of control. it sucks, but it's necessary. imagine if Muslims could write law at will nowadays, and for a hint as to what would happen go to your local Barnes and Nobles and look at the sheer amount of BULLSHIT written by idiots who somehow got publishing deals.

[khanbaba_]

the prophet also said in his last sermon that "Today Islam is complete..
there shall be, henceforth, no additions nor shall anything be deleted from my teachings..
so then..what i'm saying is that the must've, in his life, cleared out the question pertaining to the Hijab..
Where does the concept of ijma arise then?
Yes, Hadees are clear, and sometimes devinat people try to intrepret the Quran and Hadees for their personal desires so then Ijma comes. How it was understood by the majority is the right intrepretation.

Quran says
"O you who believe, obey Allah and obey the Prophet and thoseof authority among you" (4:59).
So we are order to follow Allah, Messenger and the Mujtahideen (faqeehs) who all agree on this matter.

"My Community shall not agree upon misguidance. Therefore, you must stay with the congregation, and Allah's hand is over the congregation."

"Allah's hand is over the group, follow the largest group, for verily whoever dissents from them departs to hell."

[Felonius Monk]

Noonie, just answer this for me. I can't argue with that khanbaba guy.

Is there or is there not a majority consensus on the exact dress code for women. Not asking for your view, but whether there is a view that can be considered the 'right' one Islamically without doubt.

[khanbaba_]

Good post KhanNoonienSingh

[Felonius Monk]

nvm, you answered it. saw you viewing and posted that.

[gurl_exotica]

in Sunni Islam, there are four schools of thought. Shafi, Hanbali, Maliki, and Hanafi. you can find out more about them on Wikipedia.

if you don't follow these four madhabs, but claim to be a Sunni, you're probably a Salafi or Wahabi (a.k.a. terrorist). those guys are fanatical and beat women into wearing entire burqas anyway so there's no real alternative. the four major schools of thought were the most liberal with regards to fiqh (law).

the veil can be considered in two types. Hijab (covering hair) and Niqab (leaving only eyes uncovered, ninja style).

Shafi, Maliki, and Hanbali madhabs have Niqab as Fardh (a.k.a. compulsory) with a minority of scholars dissenting and claiming Niqab as only Wajib. Wajib means it's not fardh but is strongly encouraged and should be treated as such, the reasons for which are mostly institutional... to foster the culture of wearing it. The reason things get called wajib and not fardh is so that they DON'T get codified into law (meaning you don't go around penalizing women for not wearing Niqab, but at the same time the culture of wearing the veil is established in society). they all agree Hijab is fardh.

Hanafi has Niqab as only wajib but Hijab is fardh (most Sunnis).

Shi'a Muslims follow Jafari madhab and I dunno their stance on Niqab but they do believe hijab at least is fardh.

Hijab (covering of hair) is agreed to be fardh by a clear majority of Muslims (for instance, if you call yourself a Sunni or Shi'ite, you're agreeing it's fardh). whether or not people practice it is a different story.

The Niqab-type veiling came about because the Qur'anic verse talking about women covering up used a word (plural of jilbaab) which can be interpreted as 'sheet' by someone who sucks at Arabic or the actual thing called a jilbaab which was a complete body covering (face too) at the time. And that all the hadith indicate women at the time veiled up to their eyes after this injunction. Niqab was the de facto standard way most Muslim women dressed during Prophet Muhammad(saw)'s time and for at least a thousand years afterwards throughout the various caliphates/empires/states.

Enforcement of Law:

don't listen to the Salafi/Wahabi wackos. the 'enforcement' of islamic law is to be done by an islamic government. a religious and political authority. it doesn't work like in Pakistan where they just haphazardly throw up laws (like the Hudood laws) that don't even conform to the religious standard (they say they are Hanafi-based but they have little in common with Imam Abu Hanifa's intepretation). there is no accountability in Pakistan's system.

as for 'hijab law', it's like traffic law. do cops fine every single person speeding even 1 mph over the limit at all times/places? no. they enforce strategically in order to foster the culture of obeying traffic law and driving safely. same would go for hijab. if there were a religious and political authority governing muslims based on shariah, the most they could do would be something like fine women or something similar if a large part of the population in a certain area were not wearing hijab (no action can be taken to enforce niqab). in fact, some modern scholars say Niqab should not be worn in Western countries in order to avoid persecution but they don't order it beyond recommending against it.

anyway, in the absencs of aforementioned government-type enforcement, nobody can enforce this on a woman. it's her choice. i'm not a scholar, but i personally don't go around ordering chicks to wear hijab aside from a general recommendation maybe cuz i think that might be forbidden in and of itself. only a woman's family or a government that she has pledged allegiance (baiyah) to can tell her to do anything. if she's not your wife, daughter, mother, sister, whatever and she didn't give you her allegiance (i.e, vote for you), then it's none of your damn business. you could try to educate her community or something so her family could then be made aware or something. islam's supposed to protect women from male idiots and give them the right to not have to put up with their bullshit, from all sectors, because it knows you can't write law assuming to trust people's intentions when it comes to another person's security.

why listen to these Imams? (Hanafi/Shafi/Maliki/Hanbali/Jafari)

because if we literally interpreted Islam in a historical context, then that would probably be interpreted as Niqab being fardh on everyone because that was the behaviour during Prophet(saw)'s time. these guys were really liberal and established an understanding of the law that allowed cultural context to be a factor. back then, nobody cared if Niqab was wajib or not, they assumed it to be fardh but these guys made sure to make clear distinctions on it and other issues. stuff that comes in handy now. they used Ijtihad for this, and we don't have that luxury anymore because there is no organized institution of scholarship in Islam overall anymore, just factions. there's no central authority either. guys like Al-Ghazali who is revered as a scholar helped shut the door on that period (when people could liberally make up their own interpretations pretty much) when they saw the state of affairs of the people and scholars was spiralling out of control. it sucks, but it's necessary. imagine if Muslims could write law at will nowadays, and for a hint as to what would happen go to your local Barnes and Nobles and look at the sheer amount of BULLSHIT written by idiots who somehow got publishing deals.
WOW!!
That was insightfull..
Thanks..

[khanbaba_]

WOW!!
That was insightfull..
Thanks..
So now you know its Wajib. :)

[KhanNoonienSingh]

Noonie, just answer this for me. I can't argue with that khanbaba guy.

Is there or is there not a majority consensus on the exact dress code for women. Not asking for your view, but whether there is a view that can be considered the 'right' one Islamically without doubt.
hijab (covering of hair) is pretty much consensus by like 90+% of Muslims and for the first few centuries was probably 100%.

niqab (veiling of face) was in practice during those early times and during Prophet Muhammad(pbuh)'s life by nearly all Muslim women, but islamic jurists didn't let it become obligatory. they more or less enforced simple hair covering in their law at a time when all women covered up everything. they also didn't bicker or argue, they considered each other's dissenting opinions as equally valid interpretations on islam. that kind of scholarly culture was lost, so that whole spirit of interpretation was shut down a few hundred years later (meaning Muslims today can't go about rewriting islamic law aside from what the majority of Muslims already ascribe to (a.k.a. Ijma)).

niqab being wajib would mean if you are recommending to a Muslim female relative on how to dress, you definitely should recommend the entire niqab but a lot of scholars have said don't bother with that in the west so hijab becomes the concern.

hijab isn't even wajib, khanbaba (if that's what you're saying). it's fardh.

[gurl_exotica]

So now you know its Wajib. :)
i always believed that when i start wearing the hijab i would cover my head..
at all times when in the company of na-mehram..

i just wanted someone to legibly clear my doubts..
thats it..

plus covering one's head only translates to a more modest way of dressing..
and thats definately more desirable..

thanks..:)

[KhanNoonienSingh]

Hijab/Niqab is not a political thing but it is being politicized. It's supposed to be a personal choice of women so beware of it's politicization. Both by movements critical of it and in favor of it.

here's a comment i read on guardian.co.uk from an israeli regarding that right-wing pro-ethnic-cleansing dude who got put in the cabinet:

The western world media is currently obsessed with the subjects of: women forced to wear veils, swivel eyed psychopathic imams and the bone headed arab people’s medieval superstitions. The whole of Europe is currently engaged in a desperate search for a policy that will legally allow us in to their markets and their coffers but that will keep them most decidedly out of ours. So then why should Israel behave any differently?

basically, life is going to be difficult if you're a Muslim. when you decide you know your religion and are going to practice it, which is what most people think nowadays is where the real conflict lies, the tough part is only beginning because now you have society to deal with. take advantage of your freedoms while you still have them.

[khanbaba_]

i always believed that when i start wearing the hijab i would cover my head..
at all times when in the company of na-mehram..

i just wanted someone to legibly clear my doubts..
thats it..

plus covering one's head only translates to a more modest way of dressing..
and thats definately more desirable..

thanks..:)
L0L teeq ai phir waisay hi mera dimag khate rahe if you already knew. ;)

[gurl_exotica]

L0L teeq ai phir waisay hi mera dimag khate rahe if you already knew. ;)
i just wanted to know if it was compulsory and if there was tangible proof backing it..

RD pe itne mahinon ke baad..aapka dimaag bacha hi nahin hai khaane ko..:lol:

[DasJa]

well your making it out as those the ppl who pray 5 times a day are the above, why not people who pray 5times a day and bahave even better then the ones mentioned above, who do you think will go to heaven then???

the normal average folk or the 5 times prayer with a heart clear then the diamond.
Answer my question 1st man. Obviously the pure at heart who pray 5 times a day will go to heaven...but what about the 2 comparisons I made? Namely between a greedy and treacherous guy who prays 5 times a day, and a pure simple helpful guy who prays 1-2 times max a day?!

[DasJa]

DasJa's gone to buy some keema..
someone tell him..ONLY HALAL
only halal :salut:


But u better make them propa..with some mint chutney on the side woman :Paper: ....and hurry up with the chai...i'm gettin grumpy :p

[gurl_exotica]

only halal :salut:


But u better make them propa..with some mint chutney on the side woman :Paper: ....and hurry up with the chai...i'm gettin grumpy :p
u have too many prerequisites..:hand:

[*BabyGirl*]

Sati has no Hindu basis to it....... it was banned ages ago from Hindu practice.

but Sati did originate from Hinduism. It was considered praiseworthy by the hindus.
For all those who don't know what Sati is- "Sati is the practice through which widows are brain-washed or forcibly burned alive on their husband's funeral pyre. The idea justifying sati is that women have worth only in relation to men. "
It was banned in 1956 in India, however even till today you hear about sati occuring in rural villages. :no:

I’m not religious and I don't have anything against any religion, hinduism, islam, Sikhism… or woteva. :)

[khanbaba_]

i just wanted to know if it was compulsory and if there was tangible proof backing it..

RD pe itne mahinon ke baad..aapka dimaag bacha hi nahin hai khaane ko..:lol:
Jo bacha tha tum nay aaj woh bhi kha liya :neutral:

[DasJa]

u have too many prerequisites..:hand:


Ur too lazy to be a muslim woman. :hand: you ain't gettin no gold coins thats for sure. But maybbeee...if u atleast make some bournvita..i'll think about opening up my treasures and throwing a gold lamp or necklace ur way.... :p

[DasJa]

but Sati did originate from Hinduism. It was considered praiseworthy by the hindus.
For all those who don't know what Sati is- "Sati is the practice through which widows are brain-washed or forcibly burned alive on their husband's funeral pyre. The idea justifying sati is that women have worth only in relation to men. "
It was banned in 1956 in India, however even till today you hear about sati occuring in rural villages. :no:

I’m not religious and I don't have anything against any religion, hinduism, islam, Sikhism… or woteva. :)

DAMN RIGHT!!! Meat for dinner :dance3:

[gurl_exotica]

Jo bacha tha tum nay aaj woh bhi kha liya :neutral:
*burps*

[gurl_exotica]

Ur too lazy to be a muslim woman. :hand: you ain't gettin no gold coins thats for sure. But maybbeee...if u atleast make some bournvita..i'll think about opening up my treasures and throwing a gold lamp or necklace ur way.... :p
lmao..
ur desires are so simple..its amusing..

no bournvita..:hand:
horlicks only..:hand:

[DasJa]

lmao..
ur desires are so simple..its amusing..

no bournvita..:hand:
horlicks only..:hand:

http://ensim.advenziacommerce.com/englishexports.co.uk/userdata/product/Horlicks%20Malted%20Food%20Drink%20200g.jpg

That can be so easily mis-construed here its not even funny :no:

[Space-Cowboy]

but Sati did originate from Hinduism. It was considered praiseworthy by the hindus.
For all those who don't know what Sati is- "Sati is the practice through which widows are brain-washed or forcibly burned alive on their husband's funeral pyre. The idea justifying sati is that women have worth only in relation to men. "
It was banned in 1956 in India, however even till today you hear about sati occuring in rural villages. :no:

I’m not religious and I don't have anything against any religion, hinduism, islam, Sikhism… or woteva. :)


No, it didn't 'originate' from Hinduism..... it started with corrupt brahminism practices....... it has NO Hindu basis. Furthermore, Widows were never 'forced'... they always had a choice... And it was banned by Hindus in general long before the 1956 law. It was considered a deviant practice even as far back as the time at which brahminism started the practices.... And when it WAS practiced, it was only practiced by a relative minority... it was never accept as a practice amongst the vast majority of the peoples.

And yes, there are reports of it going on in remote villages where people are uneducated...

[*BabyGirl*]

DAMN RIGHT!!! Meat for dinner :dance3:

dasja = kam from bradz?? :sarb:

[DasJa]

dasja = kam from bradz?? :sarb:
:scratch: come again..?

[*BabyGirl*]

No, it didn't 'originate' from Hinduism..... it started with corrupt brahminism practices....... it has NO Hindu basis. Furthermore, Widows were never 'forced'... they always had a choice... And it was banned by Hindus in general long before the 1956 law. It was considered a deviant practice even as far back as the time at which brahminism started the practices.... And when it WAS practiced, it was only practiced by a relative minority... it was never accept as a practice amongst the vast majority of the peoples.

And yes, there are reports of it going on in remote villages where people are uneducated...

no hindu basis eh?
It is beleived that the wife of Daksha (Sati), was so overcome at the death of her husband that she killed herself on his funeral pyre.
Sati was the consort of Lord Shiva. She burnt herself in fire as protest against her father.

yes many rulers in India tried to ban this in India aka Mughals etc. and I did stress that it is only occuring even till today only in rural villages. I only merely stated that Cz statement reminded me of sati. It's irrelevant to discuss sati in this thread really.

[*BabyGirl*]

:scratch: come again..?

:sarb: you look like a kam I know. :)

[w1ld]

Answer my question 1st man. Obviously the pure at heart who pray 5 times a day will go to heaven...but what about the 2 comparisons I made? Namely between a greedy and treacherous guy who prays 5 times a day, and a pure simple helpful guy who prays 1-2 times max a day?!

You do not judge anyone by his/her religion, you judge a person how good he/she is when it comes to his interaction with other people.

[forsaken_fr]

thanx man for sharing

[gurl_exotica]

http://ensim.advenziacommerce.com/englishexports.co.uk/userdata/product/Horlicks%20Malted%20Food%20Drink%20200g.jpg

That can be so easily mis-construed here its not even funny :no:
:rofl:

i know..

[Space-Cowboy]

no hindu basis eh?
It is beleived that the wife of Daksha (Sati), was so overcome at the death of her husband that she killed herself on his funeral pyre.
Sati was the consort of Lord Shiva. She burnt herself in fire as protest against her father.

That's a part of the 'mythology'..... which corrupt brahmins tried to pass off as religious practice.... unfortunately many bought into it... but the fact still remains that the vast majority of Hindus did not approve, nor practiced this. Again the beauty of Hinduism allows you to ignore corrupt brahmin edicts that never made sense.


yes many rulers in India tried to ban this in India aka Mughals etc.


Actually Mughals had very sinister motives to ban Sati.... so that they could steal the wives and convert the children....... most Mughal emperors had personal harems of captures princesses and queens.

I'm referring to rulers with HONEST intentions to ban it... i.e. Asoka.


and I did stress that it is only occuring even till today only in rural villages. I only merely stated that Cz statement reminded me of sati. It's irrelevant to discuss sati in this thread really.

You're right it isn't.... but don't talk about another religion when you clearly don't know enough about it.



Meanwhile, here's something to help you out:

The act of sati was supposed to take place voluntarily, and from the existing accounts, most of them were indeed voluntary. The act may have been expected of widows in some communities. The extent to which any social pressures or expectations should be considered as compulsion has been the matter of much debate in modern times. It is frequently stated that a widow could expect little of life after her husband's death, especially if she was childless. However, there were also instances where the wish of the widow to commit sati was not welcomed by others, and where efforts were made to prevent the death.[5]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sati_(practice)

The key being here that it was VOLUNTARY..... no one ever forced them.... And in fact a vast majority didn't cater to this practice at all.

[DasJa]

:sarb: you look like a kam I know. :)
You mean there's another Mr.Perfect running about?

[DasJa]

You do not judge anyone by his/her religion, you judge a person how good he/she is when it comes to his interaction with other people.
All I need is a simple answer. Hypothetical analysis bores me...if you can give me just one proper answer to this...i'll be happy. It must be written SOMEWHERE :squint:

[w1ld]

All I need is a simple answer. Hypothetical analysis bores me...if you can give me just one proper answer to this...i'll be happy. It must be written SOMEWHERE :squint:
ok...one who pray five time but is greedy and have a bad attitude will not benefit from religion...one who is not very good in praying or performing religious deeds but treat people nicely in every aspect of life has a higher place then the first person...In Islam, rights of people are more important than a person's prayer. It is said that Allah may forgive a person's religious deed but will never forgive anyone who is harmful to people.

Want more explanation?

[4u2nvqt]

seems like majority of ppls enjoyed the text i put up. well thats good. and the kicks offs have calmed down. hurray.

and yes the above post is true,,furthermore it has said, it is better to break the kaba then to brake another muslims heart.

[4u2nvqt]

thanx man for sharing


no problem

.

[*BabyGirl*]

That's a part of the 'mythology'..... which corrupt brahmins tried to pass off as religious practice.... unfortunately many bought into it... but the fact still remains that the vast majority of Hindus did not approve, nor practiced this. Again the beauty of Hinduism allows you to ignore corrupt brahmin edicts that never made sense.

The Puranas have examples of women who commit sati and there are suggestions in them that this was considered desirable or praiseworthy: A wife who dies in the company of her husband shall remain in heaven as many years as there are hairs on his person. (Garuda Purana 1.107.29)

Actually Mughals had very sinister motives to ban Sati.... so that they could steal the wives and convert the children....... most Mughal emperors had personal harems of captures princesses and queens.

I'm referring to rulers with HONEST intentions to ban it... i.e. Asoka.

Mughal period Later on in the Mughal period, pensions, gifts and rehabilitative HELP were offered to the potential SATI to WEAN her AWAY from committing the act. Children were strictly forbidden from the practice. The later Moghuls continued to put obstacles in the way but the practice carried on in the areas outside their capitals.
The strongest attempts to control it were made by Aurangzeb. In 1663, he "issued an order that in all lands under Mughal control, never again should the officials allow a woman to be burnt"

You're right it isn't.... but don't talk about another religion when you clearly don't know enough about it.

amm.. and you should do some research into history before claiming to state facts which clearly contain no substance!
The key being here that it was VOLUNTARY..... no one ever forced them.... And in fact a vast majority didn't cater to this practice at all.

women were FORCED in many cases if not forced then pressurised/impelled to commit sati!

[Space-Cowboy]

The Puranas have examples of women who commit sati and there are suggestions in them that this was considered desirable or praiseworthy: A wife who dies in the company of her husband shall remain in heaven as many years as there are hairs on his person. (Garuda Purana 1.107.29)

Puranas are not a 'hindu' text, they were created by brahmins.

Mughal period Later on in the Mughal period, pensions, gifts and rehabilitative HELP were offered to the potential SATI to WEAN her AWAY from committing the act. Children were strictly forbidden from the practice. The later Moghuls continued to put obstacles in the way but the practice carried on in the areas outside their capitals.
The strongest attempts to control it were made by Aurangzeb. In 1663, he "issued an order that in all lands under Mughal control, never again should the officials allow a woman to be burnt"

All of which were existent long before the Mughals came, get your history straight.


amm.. and you should do some research into history before claiming to state facts which clearly contain no substance!

Actually YOU need to go re-read history.......... And for the most part, we don't need outsiders telling us about our religion... If you want to learn the religion then go read the books instead of spewing utter bullshit.


women were FORCED in many cases if not forced then pressurised/impelled to commit sati!

Women were NEVER forced......... and NEVER pressured. :idea: What they did they did by choice.



women were FORCED in many cases if not forced then pressurised/impelled to commit sati!

[*BabyGirl*]

Puranas are not a 'hindu' text, they were created by brahmins.



All of which were existent long before the Mughals came, get your history straight.




Actually YOU need to go re-read history.......... And for the most part, we don't need outsiders telling us about our religion... If you want to learn the religion then go read the books instead of spewing utter bullshit.




Women were NEVER forced......... and NEVER pressured. :idea: What they did they did by choice.

:hand: oh please save your bullshit for someone who's actually going to buy it. history is history and you thinking you're right changes nothing so hop off.
outsider? lol are you sure? :rolleyes:

[Space-Cowboy]

:hand: oh please save your bullshit for someone who's actually going to buy it. history is history and you thinking you're right changes nothing so hop off.
outsider? lol are you sure? :rolleyes:

Are you a hindu? no.

We know our history better than you do. :idea:

[*BabyGirl*]

Are you a hindu? no.

We know our history better than you do. :idea:

urm. you don't know me. :neutral: layta

[Space-Cowboy]

urm. you don't know me. :neutral: layta

I'm pretty sure I do :Paper:


Oh, and meanwhile:

http://www.vivaaha.org/sati.htm

Editor's Note : Hindu religious scriptures do not demand widows to comit Sati. The word sati has been confused with word Jauhar.
In the medivial ages, when foreign Islamic armies attacked India, Jauhar or mass self immolation was comited by women when their husbads went to protect themselves from the perversions of the invading barbarians.

It is worth noting that in past one hundred years there has been only one recorded case of "Sati" in India. This event was rightfully considered illegal and those involved were charged with murder.

Here is an article by Sudheer Birodkar about Sati.

Go educate yourself. :idea: